Dake Bible Discussion Board ⇒ Thought Provoking OSAS

[Rocky]

Ed wrote: I'm not talking of people that have sat down and discussed Catholicism with their father

lol You always seem to resort to these kinds of tactics when you are presented with facts and cant find anything to use to argue with. I have not seen you present any facts or any hint of "indepth reading of their theology" as you put it. just making empty statements with nothing to back it up. Did you even read my reply. Why not discuss then give a point than counter point, then discus lol. That's how you debate, I am still waiting for any valid point from you, all you say is this catholic said this and that catholic said that. From your all of your"inepth study" what did you actually find? ...
Oh and you said

but you need to understand what they see in scripture that leads them to their belief.

No that is not right, they are not sola scripture. there beliefs are not only guided by scripture. Tradition is just as sacred to a catholic as the scriptures from the top all the way down to the laity.
.


~Edited several times because Ed is a poopy pants~

I am not resorting to any tactic I'm simply saying I have no interest in defending Catholicism to you or anyone else. But I do object to people making statements that I know are patently false. I know many Catholics that trust their salvation in nothing more or less than Jesus Christ.

Call me all the cute names you want I think it clearly speaks of your maturity but hey that how you want to be viewed so be it. As I said before that is your problem not mine.

Lol yeah I have a weird sense of humor. its how I cope with not choking someone But I have not seen any false statements. Catholics do not believe in faith alone for initial salvation, if you believe that you know nothing of the religion. The Jws say I believe in Jesus as well and so do the Mormons.

You said I know many Catholics that trust their salvation in nothing more or less than Jesus Christ

No that is is false, It is in the sacramental system that their faith really lies. Jesus is just a part of it not the source. That is why there is a saying in Catholism (Extra ecclesiam nulla salus). That is Latin for "no salvation outside the church" it is what is Ed. And, here is another, and I quote: Since the sacraments are the ordinary means through which Christ offers the grace necessary for salvation, and the Catholic Church that Christ established is the ordinary minister of those sacraments, it is appropriate to state that salvation comes through the Church. Ed what part of this are you not getting?

[Justaned]

Ed wrote: I'm not talking of people that have sat down and discussed Catholicism with their father

lol You always seem to resort to these kinds of tactics when you are presented with facts and cant find anything to use to argue with. I have not seen you present any facts or any hint of "indepth reading of their theology" as you put it. just making empty statements with nothing to back it up. Did you even read my reply. Why not discuss then give a point than counter point, then discus lol. That's how you debate, I am still waiting for any valid point from you, all you say is this catholic said this and that catholic said that. From your all of your"inepth study" what did you actually find? ...
Oh and you said

but you need to understand what they see in scripture that leads them to their belief.

No that is not right, they are not sola scripture. there beliefs are not only guided by scripture. Tradition is just as sacred to a catholic as the scriptures from the top all the way down to the laity.
.


~Edited several times because Ed is a poopy pants~

I am not resorting to any tactic I'm simply saying I have no interest in defending Catholicism to you or anyone else. But I do object to people making statements that I know are patently false. I know many Catholics that trust their salvation in nothing more or less than Jesus Christ.

Call me all the cute names you want I think it clearly speaks of your maturity but hey that how you want to be viewed so be it. As I said before that is your problem not mine.

Lol yeah I have a weird sense of humor. its how I cope with not choking someone But I have not seen any false statements. Catholics do not believe in faith alone for initial salvation, if you believe that you know nothing of the religion. The Jws say I believe in Jesus as well and so do the Mormons.

You said I know many Catholics that trust their salvation in nothing more or less than Jesus Christ

.
That is false, It is in the sacramental system that their faith really lies. That is why there is a saying in Catholism (Extra ecclesiam nulla salus). That is Latin for "no salvation outside the church" it is what is Ed. And, here is another and I quote: Since: the sacraments are the ordinary means through which Christ offers the grace necessary for salvation, and the Catholic Church that Christ established is the ordinary minister of those sacraments, it is appropriate to state that salvation comes through the Church.

And again I have no desire to defend Catholics. The point is the Body of Christ is divided. And that division came about when man decided each man could decide for himself how he would interpret scripture.

[Rocky]

And again I have no desire to defend Catholics. The point is the Body of Christ is divided. And that division came about when man decided each man could decide for himself how he would interpret scripture.

Well Ed before that The roman church interpreted scripture. I just don't believe that the reformation was all bad or you and I would be praying to Mary, believing in praying for and to the dead, and going to mass. Now I share your discouragement about the multiple denominations. But now days I could careless about how many different churches they are, I just keep my eyes fixed on Jesus.

[bibleman]

And again I have no desire to defend Catholics. The point is the Body of Christ is divided. And that division came about when man decided each man could decide for himself how he would interpret scripture.

Well Ed before that The roman church interpreted scripture. I just don't believe that the reformation was all bad or you and I would be praying to Mary, believing in praying for and to the dead, and going to mass. Now I share your discouragement about the multiple denominations. But now days I could careless about how many different churches they are, I just keep my eyes fixed on Jesus.

Hi Rocky,

But now days I could careless about how many different churches they are, I just keep my eyes fixed on Jesus.

[Justaned]

And again I have no desire to defend Catholics. The point is the Body of Christ is divided. And that division came about when man decided each man could decide for himself how he would interpret scripture.

Well Ed before that The roman church interpreted scripture. I just don't believe that the reformation was all bad or you and I would be praying to Mary, believing in praying for and to the dead, and going to mass. Now I share your discouragement about the multiple denominations. But now days I could careless about how many different churches they are, I just keep my eyes fixed on Jesus.

See that is my concern, Jesus cared about unity but we don't. In there lies the problem. Instead of us seeking unification we justify our position but saying such things as "at least we are praying to Mary." or " we aren't going to mass".

Once again we don't seek God we seek what he think or have declared to be important.

Did you ever think that perhaps God wanted us more in unity than He was worried if we went to mass or not?

Did you ever think the joke so to speak is on us. That if we had remained in unity Islam might have been just a bad memory. Or that there would not be any Mormons or JW's or Oneness or you name it.

While we have our theological correctness or so we think we have also opened the door for every wind of doctrine to blow in.

[branham1965]

HEY PREACHER
sighs....thats rubbish.
DONT YOU OR ANYONE ELSE EVER PUT ONENESS PENTECOSTALS IN THE CLASSIFICATION WITH JEHOVAHS WITNESSES OR MORMONS!!!!!! DONT EVER DO THAT.


ONE PENTECOSTALS ARE ...PENTECOSTALS REAL ONES!!!
PERHAPS THEIR THEOLOGY IS A BIT DIFFERENT.NOONE KNOWS IT ALL.NOT EVEN YOU AMEN???!!!DAD HAGIN NEVER GETS THE UGLIES TO RESPOND MUCH ON THOSE QUESTIONS.WEVE ALL SINNED.AMEN.CROWD...I SAID WEVE ALL SINNED.THEN WHAT ARE YOU GETTING ON ME FOR???

AND MILLIONS OF PEOPLE HAVE FOUND THE LORD JESUS CHRIST THROUGH THEIR RANKS.
MY MOTHER WAS A DYED IN THE WOOL HARDCORE BULLHEADED ROMAN CATHOLIC.
SHE WAS SAVED SPIRIT FILLED AND SPOKE IN OTHER TONGUES AT BISHOP POSEY'S CHURCH AFTER ONE THURSDAY AND THE FOLLOWING SUNDAY.
GOD IS IN THAT CHURCH.AND IN THAT PASTOR.HE IS A GREAT MAN.SOFT SPOKEN BUT LIKE A LION AS THE OLD PROPHETS SPOKE.
I VISITED CALVARY APOSTOLIC CHURCH RIGHT BY MY HOME.IT HAS THE SAME POWER OF GOD THERE.


ITS THE EXACT SAME SPIRIT I FELT IN REVEREND SCOTTS CHURCH,GRACE CATHEDRAL,OR OTHER SO CALLED TRINITARIAN PENTECOSTAL CHURCHES WHEN I LIVED IN CANTON.
SOME BIGOTED PEOPLE(with enticing spirits)CANT STAND IT.BUT ITS TRUE.

And again I have no desire to defend Catholics. The point is the Body of Christ is divided. And that division came about when man decided each man could decide for himself how he would interpret scripture.

Well Ed before that The roman church interpreted scripture. I just don't believe that the reformation was all bad or you and I would be praying to Mary, believing in praying for and to the dead, and going to mass. Now I share your discouragement about the multiple denominations. But now days I could careless about how many different churches they are, I just keep my eyes fixed on Jesus.

See that is my concern, Jesus cared about unity but we don't. In there lies the problem. Instead of us seeking unification we justify our position but saying such things as "at least we are praying to Mary." or " we aren't going to mass".

Once again we don't seek God we seek what he think or have declared to be important.

Did you ever think that perhaps God wanted us more in unity than He was worried if we went to mass or not?

Did you ever think the joke so to speak is on us. That if we had remained in unity Islam might have been just a bad memory. Or that there would not be any Mormons or JW's or Oneness or you name it.

While we have our theological correctness or so we think we have also opened the door for every wind of doctrine to blow in.

[branham1965]

ONENESS PENTECOSTALS are not jdubs or mormons!!!!!

if you think they are heaven help you.

[Justaned]

ONENESS PENTECOSTALS are not jdubs or mormons!!!!!

if you think they are heaven help you.

Billy
I didn't mean to imply oneness was the same as mormons or Jw. My point is every religion every theology, every cult believes they are correct or they would not be that religion, hold that theology, or be in that cult.

Many times Christians and WOF'er in particular proudly beat their chest and say using scripture they can shoot down any one that disagrees with them.

That is totally nonsense.

Case in point brilliant,skilled and gifted men, equally faithful, equally spiritual, equally dedicated to the truth have argued OSAS for over 500 years. Neither side has been able to produce convincing truth to disprove the other or to prove their position.

What they can do is shoot down any theology using scripture if everyone is using the same interpretation of scripture they are. But the minute another man decides his interpretation is superior to theirs all discussion stops.

When I was WOF I would have gone to the stake defending the theology. Today I see where I was deceived and mistaken and actually hate WOF theology. What changed? One thing as far as I can determine. That one thing is how I interpret the scriptures I once used to justify WOF theology.

[bibleman]

ONENESS PENTECOSTALS are not jdubs or mormons!!!!!

if you think they are heaven help you.

Billy
I didn't mean to imply oneness was the same as mormons or Jw. My point is every religion every theology, every cult believes they are correct or they would not be that religion, hold that theology, or be in that cult.

Many times Christians and WOF'er in particular proudly beat their chest and say using scripture they can shoot down any one that disagrees with them.

That is totally nonsense.

Case in point brilliant,skilled and gifted men, equally faithful, equally spiritual, equally dedicated to the truth have argued OSAS for over 500 years. Neither side has been able to produce convincing truth to disprove the other or to prove their position.

What they can do is shoot down any theology using scripture if everyone is using the same interpretation of scripture they are. But the minute another man decides his interpretation is superior to theirs all discussion stops.

When I was WOF I would have gone to the stake defending the theology. Today I see where I was deceived and mistaken and actually hate WOF theology. What changed? One thing as far as I can determine. That one thing is how I interpret the scriptures I once used to justify WOF theology.

Hi Ed,

Above you said: "When I was WOF I would have gone to the stake defending the theology. Today I see where I was deceived and mistaken and actually hate WOF theology. What changed? One thing as far as I can determine. That one thing is how I interpret the scriptures I once used to justify WOF theology."

I think I see your problem, you "interpret the Scriptures."

You should not do that, BUT - simply believe what is written without adding yours or others interpretations.

[branham1965]

pardon my rudeness.i understand your point.i need to

ONENESS PENTECOSTALS are not jdubs or mormons!!!!!

if you think they are heaven help you.

Billy
I didn't mean to imply oneness was the same as mormons or Jw. My point is every religion every theology, every cult believes they are correct or they would not be that religion, hold that theology, or be in that cult.

Many times Christians and WOF'er in particular proudly beat their chest and say using scripture they can shoot down any one that disagrees with them.

That is totally nonsense.

Case in point brilliant,skilled and gifted men, equally faithful, equally spiritual, equally dedicated to the truth have argued OSAS for over 500 years. Neither side has been able to produce convincing truth to disprove the other or to prove their position.

What they can do is shoot down any theology using scripture if everyone is using the same interpretation of scripture they are. But the minute another man decides his interpretation is superior to theirs all discussion stops.

When I was WOF I would have gone to the stake defending the theology. Today I see where I was deceived and mistaken and actually hate WOF theology. What changed? One thing as far as I can determine. That one thing is how I interpret the scriptures I once used to justify WOF theology.