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victoryword wrote:“First, that we see clearly from Scripture that on the cross Jesus totally defeated Satan on our behalf and that it is now our responsibility to demonstrate and administer the victory which Jesus has already won. Second, that we make proper use of the necessary weapons with which God has provided us.” Derek Prince, Spiritual Warfare, p. 31.
What? Ed what bible are you reading?Justaned wrote:What I'm saying we were not given any authority over Satan
cpbeller wrote:Billy, I never said that Ed and Watchman should not be permitted to post here. I asked WHY are they still here? I see from both of them that they feel that they are persecuted, victimized and assaulted for their beliefs. Why do they continue to stay here if they feel that they are being mistreated? Ed will post the most contrary things anytime anyone will post something from Dake's writings. In fact, it is nearly guaranteed that he will poison the thread. It seems to come naturally to him. And then, when he is confronted about it, he cries foul...and true to form, Watchman jumps in and claims Ed is being abused.
Again, I ask, if they feel so victimized, why stay here? They obviously do not agree with much of anything Dake wrote. Now, I am not saying that we all agree to everything Dake wrote, but come on...there has to be SOMETHING that Ed agrees with. But why stay at a place that you feel abuses and persecutes you? That would be similar to me going to an athiest meeting, and shouting at everyone there that they are all going to go to hell, then complain and claim victimhood when they don't like me very much. Well, of course most of them won't like me very much. I disagree with the basic tenets of their beliefs and worldview.
Same thing here when it comes to Ed and Watchman...they get on here and tell everyone that they are wrong, and tell everyone that they need to "get right with God", then slap each other on the back and claim a "high worship", while those that disagree with them are of a "low worship".
I will also go on to say this...I really don't think Watchman truly reads and comprehends what Ed is saying (to be fair, Ed doesn't even seem to comprehend what Ed is saying, since he claims he doesn't mean what he says so many times because he allows himself to accidentally sin for saying things). Watchman has had some posts that are very good, and really forces a person to look at just where they are spiritually. Too bad that all gets lost in his backslapping with a so-called Pentacostal preacher who now claims he never sins (on purpose) and preaches/teaches that we do not have authority over the enemy or victory of said enemy.
Ed and Watchman...read my disclosure posted in my signature...it is for you...
Chris
YOU ARE RIGHT REVED.SUPERB POST. 
Justaned wrote:victoryword wrote:“First, that we see clearly from Scripture that on the cross Jesus totally defeated Satan on our behalf and that it is now our responsibility to demonstrate and administer the victory which Jesus has already won. Second, that we make proper use of the necessary weapons with which God has provided us.” Derek Prince, Spiritual Warfare, p. 31.
No one is saying Satan wasn't defeated at the cross. What I'm saying we were not given any authority over Satan. We are told not to concern ourselves with Satan but to draw near to God. Instead it seems many of you want to act like a tiny dog, yapping at and pretending to be some threatening entity to a spiritual being you know nothing about or even fully understand. Interestingly this exact behavior is clearly described in scripture.Jude 1:8-13 (NASB)
8 Yet in the same way these men, also by dreaming, defile the flesh, and reject authority, and revile angelic majesties.
9 But Michael the archangel, when he disputed with the devil and argued about the body of Moses, did not dare pronounce against him a railing judgment, but said, "The Lord rebuke you!"
10 But these men revile the things which they do not understand; and the things which they know by instinct, like unreasoning animals, by these things they are destroyed.
11 Woe to them! For they have gone the way of Cain, and for pay they have rushed headlong into the error of Balaam, and perished in the rebellion of Korah.
12 These are the men who are hidden reefs in your love feasts when they feast with you without fear, caring for themselves; clouds without water, carried along by winds; autumn trees without fruit, doubly dead, uprooted;
13 wild waves of the sea, casting up their own shame like foam; wandering stars, for whom the black darkness has been reserved forever.From this the only communication or interaction I see we should have with Satan to draw closer to God and resist Satan. To say or pretend we have some authority over him is simply not scriptural. And if you read the fully passages quoted leads only to destruction of those that pretend.2 Peter 2:10-16 (NASB)
10 and especially those who indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and despise authority. Daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties,
11 whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.
12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed,
13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you,
14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;
15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet.
bibleman wrote:UH OH Ed!Justaned wrote:No one is saying Satan wasn't defeated at the cross. What I'm saying we were not given any authority over Satan.
YOU are disagreeing with Dake again.
Anything in that quote that is underlined that you agree with?We have chosen Bible Truths Unmasked as the title of this book, because it is our desire to unmask the many plain, simple, and clearly–stated biblical truths that are unnecessarily hidden from many Christians in every denomination. The devil himself is chiefly responsible for these truths being unknown. He not only blinds the minds of them that believe not (2 Cor. 4:3-4), but he steals the Word of God from the hearts of Christians, lest they should discover the means of complete victory over him—victory that is the heritage of every believer. Satan and his agents are transformed into “angels of light” and “ministers of righteousness” to deceive (2 Cor. 11:13-15). He even uses the best of saints and ministers of churches to propagate fallacies of every kind in order to rob men of the richest blessings of the Gospel of Christ. Finis J. Dake, Bible Truths Unmasked, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2003), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 7.
Ed we are given the authority over the Satan through the name of Jesus and through faith in His name. Jesus said "behold I give you power to tread on serpents and scorpions. We also have the power in the name of Jesus to cast out demon spirits. We are able to invoke the name of Jesus against the powers of Darkness. Jude and Peter both are not talking about spiritual warfare or anything to do with having or not having authority over Satan in what you used here. I am shocked at what you wrote. What kind of namby pamby hippie bible are you reading? lol.Justaned wrote:victoryword wrote:“First, that we see clearly from Scripture that on the cross Jesus totally defeated Satan on our behalf and that it is now our responsibility to demonstrate and administer the victory which Jesus has already won. Second, that we make proper use of the necessary weapons with which God has provided us.” Derek Prince, Spiritual Warfare, p. 31.
No one is saying Satan wasn't defeated at the cross. What I'm saying we were not given any authority over Satan. We are told not to concern ourselves with Satan but to draw near to God. Instead it seems many of you want to act like a tiny dog, yapping at and pretending to be some threatening entity to a spiritual being you know nothing about or even fully understand. Interestingly this exact behavior is clearly described in scripture.Jude 1:8-13 (NASB)
8 Yet in the same way these men, also by dreaming, defile the flesh, and reject authority, and revile angelic majesties.
9 But Michael the archangel, when he disputed with the devil and argued about the body of Moses, did not dare pronounce against him a railing judgment, but said, "The Lord rebuke you!"
10 But these men revile the things which they do not understand; and the things which they know by instinct, like unreasoning animals, by these things they are destroyed.
11 Woe to them! For they have gone the way of Cain, and for pay they have rushed headlong into the error of Balaam, and perished in the rebellion of Korah.
12 These are the men who are hidden reefs in your love feasts when they feast with you without fear, caring for themselves; clouds without water, carried along by winds; autumn trees without fruit, doubly dead, uprooted;
13 wild waves of the sea, casting up their own shame like foam; wandering stars, for whom the black darkness has been reserved forever.From this the only communication or interaction I see we should have with Satan to draw closer to God and resist Satan. To say or pretend we have some authority over him is simply not scriptural. And if you read the fully passages quoted leads only to destruction of those that pretend.2 Peter 2:10-16 (NASB)
10 and especially those who indulge the flesh in its corrupt desires and despise authority. Daring, self-willed, they do not tremble when they revile angelic majesties,
11 whereas angels who are greater in might and power do not bring a reviling judgment against them before the Lord.
12 But these, like unreasoning animals, born as creatures of instinct to be captured and killed, reviling where they have no knowledge, will in the destruction of those creatures also be destroyed,
13 suffering wrong as the wages of doing wrong. They count it a pleasure to revel in the daytime. They are stains and blemishes, reveling in their deceptions, as they carouse with you,
14 having eyes full of adultery that never cease from sin, enticing unstable souls, having a heart trained in greed, accursed children;
15 forsaking the right way, they have gone astray, having followed the way of Balaam, the son of Beor, who loved the wages of unrighteousness;
16 but he received a rebuke for his own transgression, for a mute donkey, speaking with a voice of a man, restrained the madness of the prophet.
So BIlly,branham1965 wrote:HOW ABOUT THE PART WHERE ALL CHRISTIANS ARE GIVEN POWER OVER WILD BEASTS.
WOULD ANY HERE BE WILLING TO PROVE THIS TRUE????
HOW MANY HOLY ONES WERE DEVOURED AND TORN APART IN THE COLISEUM???HOW MANY WERE MURDERED CRUCIFIED????bibleman wrote:UH OH Ed!Justaned wrote:No one is saying Satan wasn't defeated at the cross. What I'm saying we were not given any authority over Satan.
YOU are disagreeing with Dake again.
Anything in that quote that is underlined that you agree with?We have chosen Bible Truths Unmasked as the title of this book, because it is our desire to unmask the many plain, simple, and clearly–stated biblical truths that are unnecessarily hidden from many Christians in every denomination. The devil himself is chiefly responsible for these truths being unknown. He not only blinds the minds of them that believe not (2 Cor. 4:3-4), but he steals the Word of God from the hearts of Christians, lest they should discover the means of complete victory over him—victory that is the heritage of every believer. Satan and his agents are transformed into “angels of light” and “ministers of righteousness” to deceive (2 Cor. 11:13-15). He even uses the best of saints and ministers of churches to propagate fallacies of every kind in order to rob men of the richest blessings of the Gospel of Christ. Finis J. Dake, Bible Truths Unmasked, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2003), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 7.
We have chosen Bible Truths Unmasked as the title of this book, because it is our desire to unmask the many plain, simple, and clearly–stated biblical truths that are unnecessarily hidden from many Christians in every denomination. The devil himself is chiefly responsible for these truths being unknown. He not only blinds the minds of them that believe not (2 Cor. 4:3-4), but he steals the Word of God from the hearts of Christians, lest they should discover the means of complete victory over him—victory that is the heritage of every believer. Satan and his agents are transformed into “angels of light” and “ministers of righteousness” to deceive (2 Cor. 11:13-15). He even uses the best of saints and ministers of churches to propagate fallacies of every kind in order to rob men of the richest blessings of the Gospel of Christ. Finis J. Dake, Bible Truths Unmasked, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2003), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 7.
The John MacArthur Paraphrased Version perhapsRocky wrote:What? Ed what bible are you reading?Justaned wrote:What I'm saying we were not given any authority over Satan
bibleman wrote:So BIlly,branham1965 wrote:HOW ABOUT THE PART WHERE ALL CHRISTIANS ARE GIVEN POWER OVER WILD BEASTS.
WOULD ANY HERE BE WILLING TO PROVE THIS TRUE????
HOW MANY HOLY ONES WERE DEVOURED AND TORN APART IN THE COLISEUM???HOW MANY WERE MURDERED CRUCIFIED????bibleman wrote:UH OH Ed!Justaned wrote:No one is saying Satan wasn't defeated at the cross. What I'm saying we were not given any authority over Satan.
YOU are disagreeing with Dake again.
Anything in that quote that is underlined that you agree with?We have chosen Bible Truths Unmasked as the title of this book, because it is our desire to unmask the many plain, simple, and clearly–stated biblical truths that are unnecessarily hidden from many Christians in every denomination. The devil himself is chiefly responsible for these truths being unknown. He not only blinds the minds of them that believe not (2 Cor. 4:3-4), but he steals the Word of God from the hearts of Christians, lest they should discover the means of complete victory over him—victory that is the heritage of every believer. Satan and his agents are transformed into “angels of light” and “ministers of righteousness” to deceive (2 Cor. 11:13-15). He even uses the best of saints and ministers of churches to propagate fallacies of every kind in order to rob men of the richest blessings of the Gospel of Christ. Finis J. Dake, Bible Truths Unmasked, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2003), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 7.
Are you saying you also with Ed, disagree with Dake on this as underlined below?
We have chosen Bible Truths Unmasked as the title of this book, because it is our desire to unmask the many plain, simple, and clearly–stated biblical truths that are unnecessarily hidden from many Christians in every denomination. The devil himself is chiefly responsible for these truths being unknown. He not only blinds the minds of them that believe not (2 Cor. 4:3-4), but he steals the Word of God from the hearts of Christians, lest they should discover the means of complete victory over him—victory that is the heritage of every believer. Satan and his agents are transformed into “angels of light” and “ministers of righteousness” to deceive (2 Cor. 11:13-15). He even uses the best of saints and ministers of churches to propagate fallacies of every kind in order to rob men of the richest blessings of the Gospel of Christ. Finis J. Dake, Bible Truths Unmasked, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2003), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 7.
Biblemanbibleman wrote:Do you agree with the UNDERLINED part?Justaned wrote:On this point? I see many points.bibleman wrote:Hi Ed,Justaned wrote:bibleman wrote:Hi Chris,cpbeller wrote: I don't get how 2 ppl can say they love someone's writings (well, granted, Ed has not stated as much, but he has stated before that he is the only person who really understood what Dake really meant by what he wrote), but yet, disagree with nearly everything written by the man. It baffles my mind, it honestly, truly does.
Now that has Ed pegged to a tee!
Actually Chris, Victoryword, and Bibleman are talking through your hats. None of you have any real idea of my view of Dake. Do I say I agree with everything Dake said? Absolutely Not! Do I disagree with everything Dake said? Again Absolutely not! Do I disagree with your misuse, misinterpretation, twisting of what Dake did say? Absolutely Yes!
In fact I'm surprised that Dake publishing allows the used of the Dake name at part of this forum but that is not of my concern. I believe this forum has done more harm to Dake's name than anything thing else I'm aware of.
What a bunch of junk you have just written about your agreement with Dake. You forget one thing, we read your post on this board and we know how you despise Dake's teachings.
Here is an example in this very thread....
YOU DISAGREE with Dake on man's power over the devil.
Now set the record straight, do you agree with Dake on this point or do you disagree?In three books John makes many statements confirming what other New Testament writers say about ordinary believers having power with God over the works of the Devil.
He taught that all believers ought to walk even as Christ walked (1 Jn. 2:6);
that they have an anointing that gives complete victory over the Devil (1 Jn. 2:13-27);
that they are now "the sons of God" and it is inconceivable that God could give power to His sons to act with power over the Devil and his works, and that He would prefer them to be defeated by the Devil (1 Jn. 3:1-3);
that Christ came to destroy the works of the Devil, and that Satan has no power to touch a child of God (1 Jn. 3:8; 5:18);
that "whatsoever we ask" we receive of God (1 Jn. 3:20-24; 5:14-15);
that God has given us His Spirit and He is greater in us than the Devil is in the world (1 Jn. 4:4, 13);
that we are to be as Christ was in the world (1 Jn. 4:17);
that we can overcome the world and the Devil (1 Jn. 5:4, 18; 2:13-14);
that the truth does dwell in believers and that it sets them free from all bondage (2 Jn. 2, 4; 3 Jn. 3-4; Jn. 8:31-36);
and that it is the highest will of God that every believer "prosper and be in health, even as thy soul prospereth" (3 Jn. 2).
Finis J. Dake, The Baptism in the Holy Spirit, WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 16.
On some I agree and on others I don't agree.
And on still others I think Dake and I agree but you misuse to your pleasure.
I totally agree withHe taught that all believers ought to walk even as Christ walked (1 Jn. 2:6);
that they have an anointing that gives complete victory over the Devil (1 Jn. 2:13-27);
However on this partHe taught that all believers ought to walk even as Christ walked (1 Jn. 2:6)
Let us see what 1 John 2:13-17 says so there is no confusion.that they have an anointing that gives complete victory over the Devil (1 Jn. 2:13-27)
There is no mention of anointing. No mention of victory over Satan. It says because of your belief in Christ you have overcome the wicked one. Meaning Satan has no hold on us as Christians. He can only accuse us, lie to us, and deceive us but if we know the truth of the word, he can't deceive us. If we know the truth of the word he can't lie to us. And his accusations against us falls on deaf ears since Jesus our intercessor makes intercession for us.1 John 2:12-14 (NKJV)
12 I write to you, little children, Because your sins are forgiven you for His name's sake.
13 I write to you, fathers, Because you have known Him who is from the beginning. I write to you, young men, Because you have overcome the wicked one. I write to you, little children, Because you have known the Father.
14 I have written to you, fathers, Because you have known Him who is from the beginning. I have written to you, young men, Because you are strong, and the word of God abides in you, And you have overcome the wicked one.
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