Dake Bible Discussion Board ⇒ Finis Dake's View of Spirtual Warfare

[branham1965]

i freely admit im not being dogmatic here .i feel guilty even saying that about Reverend Dake.im a layperson.not the walking Bible.not the great scholar of Pentecost.

as macca said i think i might be trying to fit the experiences ....sighs......of my life in the Bible.

That is the Weslyan Holiness teaching.

i do not agree with the good Reverend on that.

[branham1965]

REVEREND
IF MEN OF GOD DISAGREE ON THIS HOW DO THEY YOU ANYONE EXPECT A COMMON LAYMEN TO KNOW????

WHY IS IT THAT THOSE WHO DRILL THIS THING INTO PEOPLE ....IT DOES NOT WORK??!!!!

MY FRIENDS WHO ARE RHEMA MEN 2 FROM WARREN WHO WERE GOOD FRIENDS WITH DAD HAGIN AND 1 HERE WHO IS A RHEMA MAN SAY THIS IS THE CASE.IT JUST MESSES PEOPLE UP.....REAL BAD.

BROTHER COPELAND AND DAD HAGIN NEVER ONCE TAUGHT THAT STUFF.

Hi Billy,

Well how about you?

Do you disagree with Dake on this too?

Dake says:

Both outward and inward sin must pass away or one cannot claim to be in Christ. The theory that only outward transgressions are forgiven and one is still under control of the old man (the devil) is one of the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom (2Cor. 5:17-18; Eph. 4:24; 1Jn. 5:18; Rom. 6:6-23; 8:1-13). See notes, 1Th. 4:3; 2Th. 2:13. Finis Jennings Dake, Dake's Annotated Reference Bible: Containing the Old and New Testaments of the Authorized or King James Version Text, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Bible Sales, Inc., 1997), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, Under: "Chapter 5".

[Rocky]

REVEREND
IF MEN OF GOD DISAGREE ON THIS HOW DO THEY YOU ANYONE EXPECT A COMMON LAYMEN TO KNOW????

By reading your bible and just simply taking it for what it says.
Dake has an awesome teaching on how to understand the bible and teaches how to interpret scripture in GPFM. I had to learn this as well. The bible is simple to understand if one would not just read it without an agenda. I know some would ask "If it is so easy, why can't people agree". Because bad theology is from demons and men who have agendas weather the individual is malicious or being guided by demon spirits or if it is just out of ignorance. what ever the case may be.
Here are some examples
Calvinism is about predestination- but the bible says otherwise
If someone is anti trinitarian- the bible says otherwise
If someone is a oneness the- bible says otherwise
We have no authority over the Devil -The bible says otherwise
That was just examples I could have done more, but I think you know what I am saying.
If you noticed false teachers use the same tactics, and have common themes. Double talk( is a form of speech in which inappropriate, invented or nonsense words are used to give the appearance of knowledge and so confuse or amuse the audience) Make claims that are not in the bible. Accuse verses as being added. Saying that a particular verse it is not for today. Lack of understanding of context. Their theology does not harmonize with scripture, an example of this is like if you use versus to prove your teachings or to back it up, and find that other verses contradict your understanding, then the understanding is wrong(remember the bible must harmonize). And over allegorical interpretations. So just take the bible for what it says. Gods written word is very cut and dry it just takes bad theology to confuse it, if it is wrong or bad theology it will in all cases it contradict the bible, unless it is explained a way with double talk or some the above tactics that I mentioned. That's why tactics are use to cover it up, so hearers will say oh that makes sense lol

[macca]

We have a sin nature that only leaves us when we get our purified bodies. We have a new nature that resists that sin nature but it is still there.
As for sin I agree I have already said over and over true Christians do not live in sin. If you aren't a Christian then you are a sinner and you are with Satan.

Ed, you said that you are called to strive against false teaching, but you keep teaching falsely. When you say that the born again Christian still has a "sin nature" (something the Bible does not teach) then you are saying that the redemptive work of Christ is incomplete. According to 1 Cor. 5:17 the Christian does not have a sin nature. He has a NEW NATURE!!!

This is a case of what Paul was talking about in Ephesians 6: this is a real war we are in when we see ministers of the gospel peddle open lies from the devil
designed to water down the word of God.
We should not be suprised for satan himself dresses as an angel of light so it is no wonder that his ministers masquerade as ministers of the gospel.

If you all think i am being too hard on people than you should consider the end result of this aberant teaching on the church.

macca

[bibleman]

REVEREND
IF MEN OF GOD DISAGREE ON THIS HOW DO THEY YOU ANYONE EXPECT A COMMON LAYMEN TO KNOW????

WHY IS IT THAT THOSE WHO DRILL THIS THING INTO PEOPLE ....IT DOES NOT WORK??!!!!

MY FRIENDS WHO ARE RHEMA MEN 2 FROM WARREN WHO WERE GOOD FRIENDS WITH DAD HAGIN AND 1 HERE WHO IS A RHEMA MAN SAY THIS IS THE CASE.IT JUST MESSES PEOPLE UP.....REAL BAD.

BROTHER COPELAND AND DAD HAGIN NEVER ONCE TAUGHT THAT STUFF.

Hi Billy,

Well how about you?

Do you disagree with Dake on this too?

Dake says:

Both outward and inward sin must pass away or one cannot claim to be in Christ. The theory that only outward transgressions are forgiven and one is still under control of the old man (the devil) is one of the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom (2Cor. 5:17-18; Eph. 4:24; 1Jn. 5:18; Rom. 6:6-23; 8:1-13). See notes, 1Th. 4:3; 2Th. 2:13. Finis Jennings Dake, Dake's Annotated Reference Bible: Containing the Old and New Testaments of the Authorized or King James Version Text, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Bible Sales, Inc., 1997), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, Under: "Chapter 5".

Hi Billy,

You asked: "IF MEN OF GOD DISAGREE ON THIS HOW DO THEY YOU ANYONE EXPECT A COMMON LAYMEN TO KNOW????"

All one has to do is read and study the Bible, Billy.

From a simple study of the Bible and a belief in the Scripture as found in 2 Cor 5:17, the truth can be easily seen.

2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

The old man with the sin nature passed away at the New Birth.

To believe otherwise would be: "the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom" as Dake said.

[Justaned]

Think about it Rocky what is our biggest battle. Satan? or our sin nature?
Paul often talked about fighting he often used the analogies about fighting. Saying to remain in Christ we must fight and fight and fight. He said press toward the mark, keep our eye on the goal. Yes life is a fight. But in a Christian it is a fight to keep our sin nature crucified to the cross of calvary.

The battle with Satan and sin (the "born again" Christian does not have a "sin nature" though he still struggles with the flesh). The Bible refers to Satan as "the Tempter" and equates living in sin with being of Satan (1 John 3:8). Also compare Gen. 4:7 with 1 John 3:12.

We have a sin nature that only leaves us when we get our purified bodies. We have a new nature that resists that sin nature but it is still there.
As for sin I agree I have already said over and over true Christians do not live in sin. If you aren't a Christian then you are a sinner and you are with Satan.

Hi Ed,

Above you said; " We have a sin nature that only leaves us when we get our purified bodies. We have a new nature that resists that sin nature but it is still there.

Dake says:

Both outward and inward sin must pass away or one cannot claim to be in Christ. The theory that only outward transgressions are forgiven and one is still under control of the old man (the devil) is one of the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom (2Cor. 5:17-18; Eph. 4:24; 1Jn. 5:18; Rom. 6:6-23; 8:1-13). See notes, 1Th. 4:3; 2Th. 2:13. Finis Jennings Dake, Dake's Annotated Reference Bible: Containing the Old and New Testaments of the Authorized or King James Version Text, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Bible Sales, Inc., 1997), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, Under: "Chapter 5".

Ed, would you agree with Dake that your teaching on man still having a sin nature AFTER salvation "is one of the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom " ?

Read it again Bibleman that is not what Dake said.
Do you still have lust of the flesh, lust of the eye and pride of life to deal with? Yes you do that that is our sin nature.
Adam and Eve never had these things until the serpent awakened them in garden.
I agree sin must past away and can not be excused. But to do so requires us to crucify the flesh. And even then we still need Jesus as our intercessor. If we were completely without sin then why would we need Jesus to intercede for us?

Dake is making my point you can not be in Christ and willfully sin. It is an oxymoron. That does not say mortal man will never sin. Man will still sin mostly the sin of omission and also by failing to control his emotions a Christian will unwillingly and sinfully react.

So before you charge me with disagreeing with Dake as you usually do. Don't convolute Dakes words and make sure you know what he is saying.

[Justaned]

We have a sin nature that only leaves us when we get our purified bodies. We have a new nature that resists that sin nature but it is still there.
As for sin I agree I have already said over and over true Christians do not live in sin. If you aren't a Christian then you are a sinner and you are with Satan.

Ed, you said that you are called to strive against false teaching, but you keep teaching falsely. When you say that the born again Christian still has a "sin nature" (something the Bible does not teach) then you are saying that the redemptive work of Christ is incomplete. According to 1 Cor. 5:17 the Christian does not have a sin nature. He has a NEW NATURE!!!

If we don't still have a sin nature then why do we need an intercessor Christ Jesus to intercede for us?

Of course we have a sin nature. Lust of the flesh, lust of the eye and pride of life. Or are you going to tell me you don't have to crucify the flesh?

[Justaned]

Emmanuel God with us.
That is all the spiritual warfare we need.
Think about that.

[bibleman]

Think about it Rocky what is our biggest battle. Satan? or our sin nature?
Paul often talked about fighting he often used the analogies about fighting. Saying to remain in Christ we must fight and fight and fight. He said press toward the mark, keep our eye on the goal. Yes life is a fight. But in a Christian it is a fight to keep our sin nature crucified to the cross of calvary.

The battle with Satan and sin (the "born again" Christian does not have a "sin nature" though he still struggles with the flesh). The Bible refers to Satan as "the Tempter" and equates living in sin with being of Satan (1 John 3:8). Also compare Gen. 4:7 with 1 John 3:12.

We have a sin nature that only leaves us when we get our purified bodies. We have a new nature that resists that sin nature but it is still there.
As for sin I agree I have already said over and over true Christians do not live in sin. If you aren't a Christian then you are a sinner and you are with Satan.

Hi Ed,

Above you said; " We have a sin nature that only leaves us when we get our purified bodies. We have a new nature that resists that sin nature but it is still there.

Dake says:

Both outward and inward sin must pass away or one cannot claim to be in Christ. The theory that only outward transgressions are forgiven and one is still under control of the old man (the devil) is one of the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom (2Cor. 5:17-18; Eph. 4:24; 1Jn. 5:18; Rom. 6:6-23; 8:1-13). See notes, 1Th. 4:3; 2Th. 2:13. Finis Jennings Dake, Dake's Annotated Reference Bible: Containing the Old and New Testaments of the Authorized or King James Version Text, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Bible Sales, Inc., 1997), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, Under: "Chapter 5".

Ed, would you agree with Dake that your teaching on man still having a sin nature AFTER salvation "is one of the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom " ?

Read it again Bibleman that is not what Dake said.
Do you still have lust of the flesh, lust of the eye and pride of life to deal with? Yes you do that that is our sin nature.
Adam and Eve never had these things until the serpent awakened them in garden.
I agree sin must past away and can not be excused. But to do so requires us to crucify the flesh. And even then we still need Jesus as our intercessor. If we were completely without sin then why would we need Jesus to intercede for us?

Dake is making my point you can not be in Christ and willfully sin. It is an oxymoron. That does not say mortal man will never sin. Man will still sin mostly the sin of omission and also by failing to control his emotions a Christian will unwillingly and sinfully react.

So before you charge me with disagreeing with Dake as you usually do. Don't convolute Dakes words and make sure you know what he is saying.

Hi Ed,

Above you said; " We have a sin nature that only leaves us when we get our purified bodies. We have a new nature that resists that sin nature but it is still there.

Dake says:

Both outward and inward sin must pass away or one cannot claim to be in Christ. The theory that only outward transgressions are forgiven and one is still under control of the old man (the devil) is one of the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom (2Cor. 5:17-18; Eph. 4:24; 1Jn. 5:18; Rom. 6:6-23; 8:1-13). See notes, 1Th. 4:3; 2Th. 2:13. Finis Jennings Dake, Dake's Annotated Reference Bible: Containing the Old and New Testaments of the Authorized or King James Version Text, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Bible Sales, Inc., 1997), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, Under: "Chapter 5".


Ed, would you agree with Dake that your teaching on man still having a sin nature AFTER salvation "is one of the most erroneous doctrines in Christendom " ?

[bibleman]

Read it again Bibleman that is not what Dake said.

So before you charge me with disagreeing with Dake as you usually do. Don't convolute Dakes words and make sure you know what he is saying.

How about this ED?

Is this what Dake said?

These statements of Scripture plainly state the fact that sin is something more than “transgression of the law” or outward sin, and something separate from man himself. Every one of these expressions proves that there is a real law of sin and death, and back of this law, executing it, a real power from a real nature and a real person who is stronger than man himself. It is the “old man,” “the body of sin,” and “the body of this death” that are to be destroyed, and not the body, soul, and spirit of man (Rom. 6:1-22; 8:1-13; Gal. 5:24; Col. 2:11). When this “old man” is delivered or annulled from operating in man, the body, soul, and spirit of the man as originally created are still there. Man is liberated from the devil for the first time in his life when this is done. It is the “lusts,” “desires,” and “motions of sin” from the devil in man's body, soul, and spirit that are destroyed, put to death and “put off,” and not any part of the created body, soul, or spirit of man. Finis J. Dake, God's Plan for Man, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2004), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 409.

PLUS - If you will listen to the MP3's on tape number "21B Present Dealings" you will hear a complete discussion of this Sin nature deal that you are so confused about.