Dake Bible Discussion Board ⇒ Finis Dake's View of Spirtual Warfare

[Justaned]

Oh I know already know the VICTORY in Christ that I have over the devil. That is why I don't even let Satan bother me. I draw closer to God and let my Big Brother Jesus Christ who has all authority handle Satan.

All my doubt and unbelief have been replaced with Trust in God, that God is able and willing to make all things even those things I don't want to go through work to my good, because I love God and I am called to his purpose.
That is the peace that passes all understanding. I don't have to worry if I have faith enough. My trust in God says I do.

Hi Ed,

Above you said: "Oh I know already know the VICTORY in Christ that I have over the devil."

On this post you said: "The victory belongs to Jesus we can be partakers in the victory but the victory is not ours but Christ's" http://www.dakebibleboard.com/viewtopic ... 835#p73835

I take it the excellent teaching by cpbeller has now convinced you of your victory over the devil.

THANK THE LORD, you now have victory over the devil!

PS - Good work cpbeller - the Word of God finally got through to Ed.

removed my post

[Justaned]

Congratulations Chris. You have persevered and helped Ed to see the truth. Ed, welcome to the victory side. It is great to finally have you on our team.

removed my post

[branham1965]

MAN..... WHY DONT YOU ALL LAY OFF REVED!!!!WHAT BECAUSE HIS VIEWS ARE A BIT DIFFERENT YOU ACT LIKE THAT TOWARDS HIM???? ITS NOT RIGHT.ITS BY THE GRACE OF GOD ANY OF YOU KNOW WHAT YOU KNOW.NOT BECAUSE YOU ARE SO SPECIAL!!!!!!!!!
MALIGNING AND TEARING A BROTHER DOWN IS WRONG.REVED IS 70 YEARS OLD. MY GRANDFATHER US RANGER BATTALION 6 WW2 DECORATED BY GENERAL DOUGLAS MACARTHUR ...HE WAS 67 WHEN HE DIED.AND HE THUMPED ME I MEAN FISTS TO MY HEAD A FEW TIMES.HE WOULD HAVE KICKED MY FACE IN IF I TALKED TO MY ELDERS LIKE THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[bibleman]

MAN..... WHY DONT YOU ALL LAY OFF REVED!!!!WHAT BECAUSE HIS VIEWS ARE A BIT DIFFERENT YOU ACT LIKE THAT TOWARDS HIM???? ITS NOT RIGHT.ITS BY THE GRACE OF GOD ANY OF YOU KNOW WHAT YOU KNOW.NOT BECAUSE YOU ARE SO SPECIAL!!!!!!!!!
MALIGNING AND TEARING A BROTHER DOWN IS WRONG.REVED IS 70 YEARS OLD. MY GRANDFATHER US RANGER BATTALION 6 WW2 DECORATED BY GENERAL DOUGLAS MACARTHUR ...HE WAS 67 WHEN HE DIED.AND HE THUMPED ME I MEAN FISTS TO MY HEAD A FEW TIMES.HE WOULD HAVE KICKED MY FACE IN IF I TALKED TO MY ELDERS LIKE THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So Billy,

Do you agree with REVED that the Believer does NOT have power over the devil?

[branham1965]

im just sticking up for my friend.he is a senior citizen.if folks here or anywhere were ganging upon you Reverend id do the same thing.i would.

MAN..... WHY DONT YOU ALL LAY OFF REVED!!!!WHAT BECAUSE HIS VIEWS ARE A BIT DIFFERENT YOU ACT LIKE THAT TOWARDS HIM???? ITS NOT RIGHT.ITS BY THE GRACE OF GOD ANY OF YOU KNOW WHAT YOU KNOW.NOT BECAUSE YOU ARE SO SPECIAL!!!!!!!!!
MALIGNING AND TEARING A BROTHER DOWN IS WRONG.REVED IS 70 YEARS OLD. MY GRANDFATHER US RANGER BATTALION 6 WW2 DECORATED BY GENERAL DOUGLAS MACARTHUR ...HE WAS 67 WHEN HE DIED.AND HE THUMPED ME I MEAN FISTS TO MY HEAD A FEW TIMES.HE WOULD HAVE KICKED MY FACE IN IF I TALKED TO MY ELDERS LIKE THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

So Billy,

Do you agree with REVED that the Believer does NOT have power over the devil?

[Rocky]

I have a question Why is it when someone shows Ed plain scripture he totally dismisses it? Eddy, maybe you can answer why you do that. Like if plain versus contradict your counter point than you explain it in a way that fits your point.
Here is like a summary example:
Me: Ed we have power and authority over the Devil
Ed: No we don't.
Me: Ed Jesus said we do. (Inserts Jesus quotes here)
Ed: He did not really mean that.
Me: Ed, but its in the bible.(Inserts multiple scriptures here)
Ed: well that was only for those people.
Me: God is no respecter of persons(inserts more scripture for verification)
Ed: Did that really mean that?(inserts counter scriptures that is kind of off subject or to use as counterpoints that has nothing to do with thread or subject matter and general flow of the discussion. Or they contradict previous scriptures which shows understanding of those scriptures are wrong)
Me: Ed, that doesn't make any sense, that sounds crazy.
Ed: Why are you attacking me. Does a born again Christian act like that. We have authority through Jesus by the way.
Me: but you just said we don't
Ed: Well we don't but we do through Jesus
Me: Ed that is double talking. That's what I have been saying
Ed: your problem not mine.
Me:

[Justaned]

I have a question Why is it when someone shows Ed plain scripture he totally dismisses it? Eddy, maybe you can answer why you do that. Like if plain versus contradict your counter point than you explain it in a way that fits your point.
Here is like a summary example:
Me: Ed we have power and authority over the Devil
Ed: No we don't.
Me: Ed Jesus said we do. (Inserts Jesus quotes here)
Ed: He did not really mean that.
Me: Ed, but its in the bible.(Inserts multiple scriptures here)
Ed: well that was only for those people.
Me: God is no respecter of persons(inserts more scripture for verification)
Ed: Did that really mean that?(inserts counter scriptures that is kind of off subject or to use as counterpoints that has nothing to do with thread or subject matter and general flow of the discussion. Or they contradict previous scriptures which shows understanding of those scriptures are wrong)
Me: Ed, that doesn't make any sense, that sounds crazy.
Ed: Why are you attacking me. Does a born again Christian act like that. We have authority through Jesus by the way.
Me: but you just said we don't
Ed: Well we don't but we do through Jesus
Me: Ed that is double talking. That's what I have been saying
Ed: your problem not mine.
Me:

Rocky
Why do you believe you can find scripture written specifically to a particular person and claim it as yours?
Jesus was specifically talking to the 70 when He said this.

Luke 10:17-20 (NKJV)
17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, "Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name."
18 And He said to them, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.
19 Behold, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
20 Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rather rejoice because your names are written in heaven."

How you think it is now yours?

As for the Mark 16 I never said we can't cast out demons. I said we don't have authority over Satan. Two very different things.

Rocky you say I ignore scripture, your right if the scripture does not pertain directly to me I do ignore it as far as claiming it. God told David many times to go to this place or that place. Why don't you go to those places? Because you know God was talking to David not you. So how is this any different?
Explain it to me, I can not figure out your thinking on this matter.

[bibleman]

im just sticking up for my friend.he is a senior citizen.if folks here or anywhere were ganging upon you Reverend id do the same thing.i would.

Billy,

Could you please answer my question?

Do you agree with REVED that the Believer does NOT have power over the devil?

[Rocky]

Rocky
Why do you believe you can find scripture written specifically to a particular person and claim it as yours?
Jesus was specifically talking to the 70 when He said this.

Luke 10:17-20 (NKJV)
17 Then the seventy returned with joy, saying, "Lord, even the demons are subject to us in Your name."
18 And He said to them, "I saw Satan fall like lightning from heaven.
19 Behold, I give you the authority to trample on serpents and scorpions, and over all the power of the enemy, and nothing shall by any means hurt you.
20 Nevertheless do not rejoice in this, that the spirits are subject to you, but rather rejoice because your names are written in heaven."

How you think it is now yours?

As for the Mark 16 I never said we can't cast out demons. I said we don't have authority over Satan. Two very different things.

Rocky you say I ignore scripture, your right if the scripture does not pertain directly to me I do ignore it as far as claiming it. God told David many times to go to this place or that place. Why don't you go to those places? Because you know God was talking to David not you. So how is this any different?
Explain it to me, I can not figure out your thinking on this matter.

Ok I will try, if you will read it. Because those were believers, no where does it say that this authority and power is for only certain people, and not other believers, God is no respecter of persons, and because the bible says otherwise. and I pray that you know that. The same authority is giving to all believers according to what Jesus said after his resurrection and many many other versus and scriptures through out the New testament. Now Maybe I need to clarify the word authority, because that may be what the hang-up is brother. By authority I don't mean that Satan has to appear before us to give an account or what ever. And I agree with you on using railing accusations and such as not being how to exercise authority over satan. The authority in its context that I am using is the Greek word exousiais: which means the ability or strength with which one is endued, which he either possesses or exercises. This is translated authority and Power in the New testament depending on the scripture. When Jesus said "over all the power of the enemy" in Luke 10:19 I believe what was said to the 70 is for us as well, because other scriptures confirm this fact. I believe that was just a glimpse in to the power and authority we as believers were going to be endowed with. The apostles exercised this same authority after Jesus said that to the 70 and after Jesus' resurrection, and we are told we have this as well in the bible. That is why you have so many coming against you right now on this, and you may be not trying to be hard headed and trying to spread false ideas on here. Maybe you just might have a problem with harmonizing scripture, We all do sometimes. May be you should read Gods plan for man and study the DARB for this, this will help you to do this, but it takes letting go of pride and being teachable and forsaking this devils lies that he has told you concerning the believes power and authority over him. Now do you see what I am saying? Do you agree?. Another thing I believing that by believing what you believe can hinder your prayers and healings, and any kind of victory over any satanic attack, or getting anything promised in Gods word.

[Justaned]

Rocky
Okay let us first tackle the respecter of persons issue. What is scripture saying when it says God is not repecter of persons? Acts 10:34-35 (KJV)
34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

So what scripture is actually saying is God does not just pick one nation, or one ethic group or even one person as far as spiritual truth is concerned. God will come to any that fear him and are righeousness.

The idea that what God gives to one person is given to everyone is nonsense. God gave the kingdom of Israel to David and his sons. None of us can claim that. God gave super strength to Samson but none of us have it.

The term has been misused by a group of preachers for years. Read the quoted scripture and see for yourself.

Now on to the seventy.

If you look on a time line when Jesus spoke this to the Seventy Luke 10:17-20 it was before the cross, it was a special situation because the Holy Spirit had not yet been give. He was sending unprotected and if you will innocent people into possible harms way without the Holy Spirit to guide them. Also His defeat of Satan had not yet occurred.

For these reasons you can not apply this verse to us today.

You said the Apostles bore the same anointing after the cross. In Luke 10:17-20 nothing could harm them. However we know that every Apostle with the exception of John was in fact put to death, many were whipped, mistreated, beaten and abused. So they didn't carry the same protection the 70 did. Look at the early church they were abused, tortured, raped, they watched their children being raped and brutalized before being killed, they themselves were dipped in animal fat and set afire all to entertain Rome. And it was their death not their power over evil that opened Romes eyes and made the Emperor of the day Christianity the state religion.

Does that mean we are defenseless today? NO Absolutely not. Jesus has since gone to the cross and He was given all authority by the Father, Jesus hold the keys of death and hell. Satan is restrained by that, being able to only what Jesus permits him to do. But we also have power, the power to resist Satan by drawing close to God. As we resist temptation Satan gets frustrated and leaves.

We also have the power to rebuke Satan in name of the Lord, that means we can set him straight when he tries to confuse us by miss quoting scripture and deception. However that is about the limit of our power. Demons are another thing entirely and something best left for another topic.

Remember as long as we are under the blood Satan will not cross the blood line, he can not snatch us from the hand of God.

Now the reason so many are against me is because I'm dealing with deception that has been a part of the some theology for years. A theology that some say Dake had but I disagree with. As I read Dake's teachings I believe he fully understood his position in Christ in relation to Satan. A few say I'm wrong but that is okay, they cite all kinds of things but most of it is statements ripped from context and used in a way the original speaker never intended.

I'm glad you agree with my position on spiritual warfare and if you do and if you think it through you will see all of this fits.

As far as Satan doing bad things to us today. Satan can deceive us. Satan can tempt us, Satan bears false witness of us to the Lord. But we have the word that should prevent deception if we will read it and study it. We have the Holy Spirit and our new nature to help us resist temptation and we knew Jesus our intercessor is making intercession for us in Heaven.

But disease still comes, that is right we live in a sin tainted world, our cells have mutated due to chemicals and actions we have experienced, germs and viruses have turned deadly and effect us. We also refuse to deal many times with the lust of flesh, lust of our eyes, and pride of life. All of these will lead us into death both physical and spiritual.

When a child steps off a curb and gets hit and killed by a car it is very convenient to blame Satan but in fact many factors were probably involved. Lust of the flesh by the child to get across the street without looking, pride of life by the driver not paying attention and probably speeding. Possibly lust of the flesh and pride of life showing up as rebellion making the child disobey the admonishment of his parents, of his teacher that told him to look both ways.

Think about your own life you probably did something unthinking today that could have cost you, your life. Why because Satan blinded you? Easy and convenient to say and buy into but if you really think about it was your own self will that opened the door. Thankful our Lord pulls our fat from the fire many times.

As long as we live in this sin tainted world death, sickness, injury, and regret will effect us. That is truth. It did in the lives of the Apostles and it did in the lives of the early church, it did in the lives of the church of the middle ages and it does today. Only when we get to heaven will we be free of the curse that came from sin.

So what am I saying? Do we live in fear. No Absolutely not! Fear is not of the love. We have the greatest promise of the Bible. God said he would make all things work to our good if we loved Him and were serving as called to His service.

That one promise is very powerful and many want to downplay it. There are many reasons for wanting to downplay this because like Grace it is freely given, we just need to trust in God for it. Many want to show they deserve God's promise because of their mighty faith yet the word clearly states faith is a gift of God. And likewise the want to be able to blame any failure on someone's lack of faith.

Each day I place my trust in God and I know that no matter what occurs that day, God had my best interests first and foremost. My task is not to engage Satan in some fake combat but to rest in God, drawing close and seeking Him first over everything else. That my friend is the peace that passes all understanding. And until you have it you won't understand.