Dake Bible Discussion Board ⇒ Did Peter lose his salvation?

[Reuben]

We also must remember that when one would "believe on his name" they would be saved. Because, his name meant "Saviour" so when one would believe on his name they was believing him to be their saviour. Here again is scripture to prove the point. It's interesting in the discourse between Jesus and Nicodemus how Jesus describes salvation throughout John 3. Then when he gets to John 3:18 (KJV)
18 He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God.
When Peter believed on the name of Jesus he was believing him for his salvation.

[Justaned]

"Marx and Engels never tried to refute their opponents with argument. They insulted, ridiculed, derided, slandered, and traduced them, and in the use of these methods their followers are not less expert. Their polemic is directed never against the argument of the opponent, but always against his person."

Not sure of your point above when I have given continual proof of my position that Peter was saved and used Scripture to back the point. Not only that, I have allowed Scripture to speak for itself. Maybe I can list it again.

According to this Scripture - Peter confirmed his faith.
John 6:68-69 (KJV)
68 Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.
69 And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God.

Upon this confession you have the evidence of Scripture confirming his experience,
1 John 5:1 (KJV)
1 Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him.

Then, it clearly states that Peter was cleansed from sin and then obeyed the Word of the Lord.
John 13:10 (KJV)
10 Jesus saith to him, He that is washed needeth not save to wash his feet, but is clean every whit: and ye are clean, but not all.
John 15:3 (KJV)
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
John 17:6 (KJV)
6 I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word.

Then, more evidence comes in from Scripture when it says his name was currently written in Heaven.
Luke 10:20 (KJV)
20 Notwithstanding in this rejoice not, that the spirits are subject unto you; but rather rejoice, because your names are written in heaven.

From John 13 on, Jesus is speaking with his disciples. In the context of John 15:3 he speaks of Peter (which is included) being in Christ.
John 15:1-6 (KJV)
1 I am the true vine, and my Father is the husbandman.
2 Every branch in me that beareth not fruit he taketh away: and every branch that beareth fruit, he purgeth it, that it may bring forth more fruit.
3 Now ye are clean through the word which I have spoken unto you.
4 Abide in me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, except it abide in the vine; no more can ye, except ye abide in me.
5 I am the vine, ye are the branches: He that abideth in me, and I in him, the same bringeth forth much fruit: for without me ye can do nothing.
6 If a man abide not in me, he is cast forth as a branch, and is withered; and men gather them, and cast them into the fire, and they are burned.

Peter was saved from the world.
John 17:14-16 (KJV)
14 I have given them thy word; and the world hath hated them, because they are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.
15 I pray not that thou shouldest take them out of the world, but that thou shouldest keep them from the evil.
16 They are not of the world, even as I am not of the world.

Peter was baptized and baptized others.
John 4:1-2 (KJV)
1 When therefore the Lord knew how the Pharisees had heard that Jesus made and baptized more disciples than John,
2 (Though Jesus himself baptized not, but his disciples,)

Peter had the Holy Spirit according to the following.
Matthew 10:20 (KJV)
20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

Peter cast out devils and healed the sick.
Mark 6:7-13 (KJV)
7 And he called unto him the twelve, and began to send them forth by two and two; and gave them power over unclean spirits;
8 And commanded them that they should take nothing for their journey, save a staff only; no scrip, no bread, no money in their purse:
9 But be shod with sandals; and not put on two coats.
10 And he said unto them, In what place soever ye enter into an house, there abide till ye depart from that place.
11 And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear you, when ye depart thence, shake off the dust under your feet for a testimony against them. Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.
12 And they went out, and preached that men should repent.
13 And they cast out many devils, and anointed with oil many that were sick, and healed them.

Luke 9:6 (KJV)
6 And they departed, and went through the towns, preaching the gospel, and healing every where.


So, again, I have given nothing but Scripture to prove the point.

And I conceded the point. What I don't concede is Peter is a normative example of salvation or that what you call his lost of salvation is a classic example of someone being saved and losing their salvation. If you think it is normative fantastic but I don't. Find another example and stop trying to dig out your pound of flesh.

[brodave]

Where men born again before Jesus was raised from the dead?

[Justaned]

Where men born again before Jesus was raised from the dead?

I don't think so but evidently Reuben does, so I will let him explain how he came to that conclusion.

[brodave]

The believers in the Old Testament were saved' but were they born again in the same since we are born again. When we are born again the Holy Spirit comes in and dwells in us. Jesus told His disciples the Spirit is with you and shall be in you. Believers in the Old Testament did not have the Spirit in them.

[brodave]

So if they were born again as we are born again why did Jesus bare our sins on the cross?

[branham1965]

folks ay they looked foward to the Cross.
this sounds good but
it contradicts other passages in the New Testament .
Jesus told His disciples the Holy Ghost dwelleth WITH you and He shall be IN you.

in JOHN 7:37 JESUS STOOD UP AND CRIED.OUT..ive noticed in these passages when Jesus cried out it means He stood up and roared as the Lion of Judah!!!!
VERSE 39 BUT THIS SPAKE HE OF THE SPIRIT WHICH THEY THAT BELIEVE ON HIM SHOULD RECIEVE FOR THE HOLY GHOST WAS NOT YET GIVEN BECAUSE THAT JESUS WAS NOT GLORIED."
HE CAME IN ACTS AND HAS BEEN INSIDE PEOPLE WHO DID WHAT ACTS REPENT BE BAPTIZED IN THE NAME OF JESUS CHRIST FOR THE REMISSION OF SINS AND YE SHALL RECIEVE THE GIFT OF THE HOLY GHOST.2:38 PETER COMMANDED THEM AND US ACTS 10.
SEE THESE IS VERY VERY IMORTANT AND I WAS STUNNED WHEN I REALISED IT.FOLKS SAY HE REALLY ISNT IN YOU.HE IS IN UNIOUN WITH YOU.
THATS FALSE.THIS IS TAUGHT BECAUSE OF AN ERRONEOUS UNDERSTANTING OF THE GODHEAD.
SO IN MY VIEW THEY HAVE THAT QUITE WRONG.

So if they were born again as we are born again why did Jesus bare our sins on the cross?

[Justaned]

So if they were born again as we are born again why did Jesus bare our sins on the cross?

My question exactly Brodave. It would have made not sense for Jesus to sacrifice Himself if he could have made us born again through HIs words.

I really believe the american church has lost the real concept of being born again. Where Jesus become Lord of your life, not just a very important piece. To make Jesus Lord requires you to crucify the flesh and so many today are more worried about the welfare of their flesh than they are the welfare of their spirit. To make Jesus Lord of you life requires you to lay down your rights, your wants, you aspirations and seek God's wants, God's aspiration for you. Today everyone talks about respect, but Jesus being God showed us it wasn't about receiving respect it was about doing the will of God. The disciples and Paul followed suit as did the early Christian Church. They were praying as people used and abused them, told lies about them, made them suffer untold hardships, suffer horrendous deaths.
Today's American Christian can't come to church if it is raining, of they are too tired, or the church's heat is off and it is too cold, or if the church's air is broken and it is too hot. Today's Christian will not come to church unless the church feeds their perceived needs.

I don't think we the American church knows what it means to be born again but we believe we are capable of inventing doctrine to justify sinful behavior.

[Rocky]

I really believe the american church has lost the real concept of being born again. Where Jesus become Lord of your life, not just a very important piece. To make Jesus Lord requires you to crucify the flesh and so many today are more worried about the welfare of their flesh than they are the welfare of their spirit. To make Jesus Lord of you life requires you to lay down your rights, your wants, you aspirations and seek God's wants, God's aspiration for you. Today everyone talks about respect, but Jesus being God showed us it wasn't about receiving respect it was about doing the will of God. The disciples and Paul followed suit as did the early Christian Church. They were praying as people used and abused them, told lies about them, made them suffer untold hardships, suffer horrendous deaths.
Today's American Christian can't come to church if it is raining, of they are too tired, or the church's heat is off and it is too cold, or if the church's air is broken and it is too hot. Today's Christian will not come to church unless the church feeds their perceived needs.

I don't think we the American church knows what it means to be born again but we believe we are capable of inventing doctrine to justify sinful behavior.

Ed so are you stevie super Christian?

[Justaned]

I really believe the american church has lost the real concept of being born again. Where Jesus become Lord of your life, not just a very important piece. To make Jesus Lord requires you to crucify the flesh and so many today are more worried about the welfare of their flesh than they are the welfare of their spirit. To make Jesus Lord of you life requires you to lay down your rights, your wants, you aspirations and seek God's wants, God's aspiration for you. Today everyone talks about respect, but Jesus being God showed us it wasn't about receiving respect it was about doing the will of God. The disciples and Paul followed suit as did the early Christian Church. They were praying as people used and abused them, told lies about them, made them suffer untold hardships, suffer horrendous deaths.
Today's American Christian can't come to church if it is raining, of they are too tired, or the church's heat is off and it is too cold, or if the church's air is broken and it is too hot. Today's Christian will not come to church unless the church feeds their perceived needs.

I don't think we the American church knows what it means to be born again but we believe we are capable of inventing doctrine to justify sinful behavior.

Ed so are you stevie super Christian?

No I just read scripture that says without holiness no one will see the face of God.