Dake Bible Discussion Board ⇒ Finis Dake's View of Spirtual Warfare

[victoryword]

Macca, are you trying to say that plain old Scripture should settle this matter? If that were the case this thread would have died a long time ago. When one has a bias towards something, they would debate with Jesus Himself while He is talking to them from smoke and fire on a holy mountain

[macca]

Well, it was good enough for Jesus to say, "it is written" and they all shut up and ran away.

macca

[branham1965]

i believe you REVED.and i have your back.
you are actually teaching what i heard at Grace Cathedral and Living Faith Apostolic.this is old school Pentecostal teaching.old timers taught this way.the new introduction of teaching which seems opposite to this is WOF Charismatic teaching which ranges from the rock solid on one end and then digresses to the complete maniacal lunatic fringe.people having farting demons ,booger demons ,bad breath demons,constipation demons and so on

one can quote that the LORD IS A MAN OF WAR until the cows come home.YET IF ISRAEL WENT OUT INTO BATTLE IN A SINFUL CONDITION OUT OF THE WILL OF JEHOVAH THEY GOT THEIR BRAINS BEAT IN.one must be in the will of God ,be clean and have their heart prepared to seek the LORD to appropriate His provision of victory over the enemy.

PREACH ON REVED!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! AND if God allows it im going to eat 15 of the 20 pound turkey mom bought!!!!

rocky
Your theology is totally messed up, you have bits and pieces of every theology known to man scattered in yours.
Is it not true that scripture says that when we are weak God is strong?
Is it not true that scripture says the battle is the Lords?
Is it not true scripture says to submit to God?
We don't have to fight the enemy, Satan is defeated. What we have to fight is our inborn sin nature. Lust of the eyes that would draw away in sin. Lust of flesh that makes us hungry for things of this world instead of spiritual realities and the pride of life that makes us think we are something we are not. It is not our battle, the battle has been fought and Satan lost. What we have to do is keep looking at God instead of trying to see what Satan may be up to.
I can assure that any young Christian that reads what I say and keeps their eyes firmly fixed on God does not have to fear Satan. Jesus has promised to do that for us. All we have to do is wear the armor that God has provided and stand.
Notice it doesn't say start fighting the fight is says STAND.

Do you believe this or not? Romans 8:38-39 (NKJV)

38 For I am persuaded that neither death nor life, nor angels nor principalities nor powers, nor things present nor things to come,
39 nor height nor depth, nor any other created thing, shall be able to separate us from the love of God which is in Christ Jesus our Lord.

Are you under the blood of Jesus or not?
Do you really believe Satan can cross the blood of Jesus to get to you?
Do you believe the cross was a victory or defeat? That is the question. For those that think Jesus was defeated at the cross then I can see why you think you need to continue to fight Satan. But for us that know the cross was a victory for Jesus and total defeat for Satan we know that Jesus protects us from all that the enemy would try to tell us he can do.

I guess the real question is do you trust in God or not? If you believe you survive by your own ability to do spiritual warfare then you are at best prideful and at worst totally ignorant of real meaning of the cross.

Ed, none of us that on here that believe we have authority over Satan is saying we have it in ourselves. Maybe some day you will actually be confronted by an attack or God forbid a possessed person, or maybe will actually have to go through something because of your faith. Then you can look back at this and remember what we are trying to tell you. Why don't you say that Satan is no more an adversary to someone's family who was killed because of the Gospel or someone believing God for a healing or when the Devil attacks someone because he is a Christian. What's next, are you are going to tell me that Satan is already bound? Ed you must live in lala land, rode any unicorns lately? Gosh I just can't believe the stuff you come up with. And I am the freak lol.. I am just going to say it Ed,when you say "We don't have to fight the enemy" that is big giant pile of poo, and it stinks, oh yes Ed, it stinks very badly.

rocky
See you were having a normal discussion and offering an opinion then you started the unicorn personal attacks. Why did you feel you needed to do that? Is that how you want to be treated? I don't get it.

We don't have authority over Satan in ourselves or otherwise. Satan does not answer to us, yet he must answer to God and Christ Jesus. However I do believe Jesus has given us a victory in that Satan can not cross the blood line of Jesus. But it does require us to stay under the blood.

I have dealt with demonics and I know it was not by my might or by my power, nor by my authority but by the authority in the name of Jesus Christ that demons will flee. They don't flee me but flee the name of Jesus. No I'm not telling you Satan is bound but most that happens today is not of Satan but is the fleshly lusts of man. Lust of eyes, lust of the flesh and pride of life. These are ingrained in our sin nature that must be crucified on the cross.

YOu don't have to fight the enemy you have to draw close to God and resist the enemy. Big difference. What are you going to fight with? You know nothing of the spiritual realm where Satan resides. We must deal with demonics because they have manifested themselves in our physical reality. But again the fight in not ours but it is the Lords.

This discussion started when someone spoke of THEIR AUTHORITY over Satan. I asked and still do show me where we have authority over Satan. Jesus is the one with all authority not us.

Believe me I have been under attack by evil spiritual beings. Godly spiritual influences would not call me the names I have been called in this thread alone. Those kind of names come from one place and one place only. Ephesians 6:12 (NKJV)
12 For we do not wrestle against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this age, against spiritual hosts of wickedness in the heavenly places.
So I take up my armor and stand. Jesus will fight the battle.

[cpbeller]

Now Macca...come one now....you know good and well that we are all wrong*, and God did not actually mean what He said*...That would make God too simple*, afterall, God is God, and His ways are past finding out*. In fact, God is God and his ways are past finding out*. In fact, God is God, and his ways are past finding out*...whoa...ok, sorry about that, became like a broken Ed, I mean, broken record, for a moment.*

Anyways, I agree with you. For a pentacostal (so-called) to say (and believe) that we have no authority over the enemy is simply so incredibly absurd*, I do not know even where to start*. And for his "great man of the Lord"* to jump in with both feet to back him up*? Yeesh...I pray for the poor souls who have subjected themselves to their crazy doctrine.*

*Now, for those of you who may be offended at what I said, read my disclaimer below

EDITED to make sure I was completely disclaimered up...I am now, so read on with the full assurance I may or may not be speaking to you or not to you, based off of what you may or may not believe, or...well, just ready my disclaimer below for the details!! oh, forgot to add my disclaimer reminder...here it is: " * "

[victoryword]

Those of you who know Pastor Joe McIntyre and are familiar with his book, "EW Kenyon and His Message of Faith" should watch this video. He gives a wonderful explanation of this subject.

[video][/video]

[Justaned]

Do we have authority over satan and his church?

Heb. 1:4;
(Jesus) Being made so much better than the angels, as he has by inheritance obtained a more excellent NAME than tyey.

Eph. 1.19-21;
what is the exceeding greatness of His power
which He wrought in Christ, when He raised Him from the dead, and set Him at His own right hand in the heavenly places,
Far above ALL principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and EVERY NAME THAT IS NAMED, not only in this world, but also in that which is to come.

Phil. 2.9-10;
Wherefore God has highly exalted Him, and given Him a NAME which is above every name.
That at the name of Jesus EVERY knee should bow, of beings in heaven, and beings on earth, and beings under the earth.
(satan is included in EVERY KNEE)

The name of Jesus belongs to the church.

Eph. 1.21-23;
jesus is far above all principality, and power, and might, and dominion, and every name that is named, not only in this world,
but also in that which is to come.
And God has put all things under His feet, and gave Him to be head over all things to the CHURCH,
which is His body, the fullness of Him that fills all in all.

1Cor. 12:27-28;
Now you are the BODY OF CHRIST, and members in PARTICULAR.
and God has set some in the CHURCH.

jOHN. 14:12-14;
Truely, truely, I say to you, he that believes on me, the works that I do shall he do also, and greater works than these shall he do, because I go to my Father.
And whatsoever you shall ask (demand) IN MY NAME, that I will do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son.
If you shall ask (demand) any thing IN MY NAME, I will do it.

The word of God is clear.

Macca
Do these verses really say you have authority over Satan? Does Satan have to respond to you? Can you command Satan to do anything? If you can tell him to report to you and tell you specifically what trouble he created in the last 24 hours.

[Justaned]

Well, it was good enough for Jesus to say, "it is written" and they all shut up and ran away.

macca

That is because what Jesus said was truth. Notice no one tried to claim Jesus' authority or say stand aside Jesus I will handle this by the authority I have.

[Justaned]

Those of you who know Pastor Joe McIntyre and are familiar with his book, "EW Kenyon and His Message of Faith" should watch this video. He gives a wonderful explanation of this subject.

EW Kenyon was a metaphysics teacher. He claimed nothing existed before it was spoken into existence. In other words if someone was hit with a car and have their leg torn off, it really doesn't happen until the person says my leg is torn off. Or the ambulance driver say his leg is torn off, see if you can find it so we can try to sew it back on. The idea goes on to say the leg goes into hiding if the rescue crew says I can't find the leg. However if the person hit says my legs are fine then the doctors at the hospital don't even need to check them or try to stop the blood flowing out of where the leg once was.

If you even remotely believe in the power of metaphysics using words to create reality you need help.

[cpbeller]

Ed: "...authority in the name of Jesus Christ that demons will flee."

Ed, are you really, truly that dense? Who used the Name of Jesus in this instance that you were talking about confronting demons? YOU used the Name. Therefore, you used the authority to use the Name. Unless you used the Name without permission, or AUTHORITY to use His Name.

It really is not that difficult to figure out and understand if you didn't have to prove everyone on this message board (except your "strong man in the Lord") is wrong. I mean, afterall, we like that dreaded and evil Kenneth Copeland. Who would like HIM, other than someone who is always wrong, right?

The fact of the matter is, we have been given victory over the enemy. We have been given authority over the enemy. Dake taught this. Every pentacostal preacher I have ever heard taught/teaches this (except you, but I don't consider you a minister anymore than a rat in an Ohio outhouse, if you are really believing the stuff you are saying). The fact that you seem to believe we are not co-workers with God, joint-heirs with Christ, heirs of God, been given the Name of Jesus to use (which, by your own admission, you have done at least once)...you do not believe any of this, if you believe we do not have authority over the enemy...

What is it you say about everyone that disagrees with you? Oh yeah...what you believe is NONSENSE and PURE RUBBISH.

[victoryword]

EW Kenyon was a metaphysics teacher. He claimed nothing existed before it was spoken into existence.

Ed, the difference between you and me is I have read Kenyon. You have read what Kenyon's lying critics have said about Kenyon. You have gone on to repeat the lie. Here is a statement from Kenyon's own writings:

• Christian Science, Unity, and other Metaphysical and philosophical teachers of today do not believe that God is a person. They will tell you that He is a perfect mind, but He has no location. It is just a great universal mind which finds its home in every individual. He has no headquarters. It is a mind without a brain, without personality. They do not believe in sin as Paul taught it in the Revelation given to him. They do not believe that Jesus died for our sins, but that He died as a martyr. They do not believe He had a literal resurrection, a physical resurrection, but as one puts it, "a metaphysical resurrection." (whatever that means).
  
  If God is not a person and Jesus did not put sin away, then who is Jesus and what is the value of our faith in Him? One of them calls Him "The way-shower". He is not a way-shower. HE IS THE WAY. Their faith in Jesus and their faith in God is, after all, faith in themselves and what they inherently have within themselves. -Kenyon, The Two Kinds of Faith, pp. 17, 18

Kenyon was not even close to sympathizing with metaphysical cults. He strongly stood against their doctrine and I have much more quotes from his writings that can prove that.