Dake Bible Discussion Board ⇒ Jimmy Swaggart said my dear friend Finis Jennings Dake

[branham1965]

i think his GREATEST MISTAKE after his fall was to refuse the correction process of the Assemblies of God.THAT WAS IT.

MACCA
HOW ON EARTH IS HE LEADING PEOPLE AWAY FROM JESUS AND THE PURITY OF THE GOSPEL????????HE PREACHES JESUS AND HIM CRUCIFIED??????

Like i said Jimmy is a glory hunter, he did not take correction and never will,.
He is justified in his own mind.
His final fall will be the greater for he has led and is leading many away from Jesus and the purity of the gospel.

John.6:16-18
My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me.
If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God
or whether I speak of My own authority.

HE WHO SPEAKES FROM HIMSELF SEEKS HIS OWN GLORY;

But he who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.


macca

[Ironman]

Like i said Jimmy is a glory hunter, he did not take correction and never will,.
He is justified in his own mind.
His final fall will be the greater for he has led and is leading many away from Jesus and the purity of the gospel.

John.6:16-18
My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me.
If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God
or whether I speak of My own authority.

HE WHO SPEAKES FROM HIMSELF SEEKS HIS OWN GLORY;

But he who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.


macca

Thanks 'macca.'
None of us are prefect, although we here are working on being so and with the help of the Holy Spirit and Jesus our Mediator we will eventually be so. I think Swaggart started off with all the right and good intentions, like Jim Bakker and his wife, read his book, "I WAS WRONG," Then the money, the power, the adoration by people especially young flirtacious women, I have seen this in Churches I belonged to, and the personal glory as you say, all levers Satan uses against 'US' takes over! Jim Swaggart caught up a few, indeed many, then maybe millions of believers, sadly power, glory, self glorification prevales and many who love to be entertained, love to be with the 'IN CROWD,' are lead down the wide road! The 'Few' see this and leave, the 'Many' just tag along for the entertainment and ride!

[Justaned]

My question with all the thousands of Pastors/Teachers and Evangelist that haven't fallen, that have flawless reputations why seek after Swaggart?

That forces the question are you following the teaching or the celebrity?

Hi Ed,

Just what "Pastors/Teachers and Evangelist" "that have flawless reputation"

What TV Evangelist would you recommend?

I have told you I don't watch TV evangelist. Scripture says not to forsake the assembling together. I want a person that is accountable to me and me to them. Without accountability you have nothing.

Hi Ed,

Above you said: "My question with all the thousands of Pastors/Teachers and Evangelist that haven't fallen, that have flawless reputations why seek after Swaggart?"

So I ask you to name one of these that haven't fallen.

And you can't even give one name.

So then, that statement you made must not be true.

Please check out your facts before you speak in the future.

Thanks

Bibleman

You said because I didn't list a name my statement must not be true. Okay tell me what part isn't true?

That there are thousands of men and women in ministry today in the US that have unblemished reputations?

Or that Swaggart had a number of moral failures?

Your statement was absolutely ridiculous now wasn't it?

[Rocky]

"MACCA
HOW ON EARTH IS HE LEADING PEOPLE AWAY FROM JESUS AND THE PURITY OF THE GOSPEL????????HE PREACHES JESUS AND HIM CRUCIFIED??????" Yes but in Jimmy's cross theology it is twisted and confusing.
I am not sure what MACCA 's answer is But I think I know what he is saying.
Jimmy theology is one of sanctification. I will try to break down his theology, so bare with me. I hope it will not take to long to do.
OK, First of all Jimmy claims this revelation came directly from God to him, this is the first RED FLAG almost reminiscent of all cult leaders. (I know, an outlandish claim But that's what he is in my humble opinion)
The theology is this, as I said in a previous reply, The born again believer will be ruled by the sin nature unless he puts his faith in exclusively in the cross. Now this statement is very vague to say the least.
Then he goes on to say the cross must be the ever object of our faith in order for the Holy spirit to work in our lives, and through faith in the cross we get this victory over the sin nature. Jimmy uses this to explain his actions in the 80s and 90s by saying in his book the reason why he did what he did is because he didn't understand the cross. But the bible says a "man is drawn away by his own lust", go and sin no more Jimmy, its not rocket science, The statements that jimmy says are not found in scripture. Dake's teaching on sanctification and Jimmy's is completely different. Just read Romans chapter 7 in the DARB and and then Jimmy's commentary Bible in that same chapter and you will see what I am talking about.
Also pertaining to salvation in Jimmy's cross theology its the same you cannot be saved unless you put your faith in the cross, but the bible says put your faith is Jesus. Not just his crucifixion. The bible gives many aspects about Jesus that one is suppose to put their faith in. Here is just a few:
1 in him being the son of God
2 that he came in the flesh
3 the virgin birth
4 that he is the messiah
5 that he was crucified
6 Resurrected
7 Ascended
8 That he is coming back
Basically ones faith must be put in Jesus, in who he is, what he did and all that entails, not just the crucifixion only or the Cross that Jesus was crucified on.
His whole Expositors bible is completely centered around his theology, the meat of it is "the cross". I believe Jimmy has an agenda, it is to either justify or excuse his actions so he can continue on Television and make that money or else he would have to get a real job, (Oops sorry that was the bad Rocky). The denomination that he was affiliated with wanted him to under go treatment and their process of restoration before he started preaching again. That's why on his TV channel all he does is knock other churches and other denomination. Jimmy did not want submit to what the Assemblies of God wanted him to do to, he wanted it his way. He continued preaching through his fall and never stopped. Oh yes, he was off TV for while, but still continued to minister, so it never was a fall so to speak, he never stepped down. This theology came about in 97, only 6 years after the incident that the assemblies of God wanted to deal with, and this was not an isolated incident, it happen over a period of years. The misconception here is that Jimmy stepped down, he never did. He did lose some of his followers, but he still continued preaching through it all. Now this is my opinion. But this is also coming from a couple years worth of study. I was very much into him and studied his teachings, until I believe the Lord gave me discernment about this. I believe in restoration but not in this way, And not with an underlined agenda. In the end its all about the Money.

[branham1965]

WHY DONT YOU ANSWER ME???

Like i said Jimmy is a glory hunter, he did not take correction and never will,.
He is justified in his own mind.
His final fall will be the greater for he has led and is leading many away from Jesus and the purity of the gospel.

John.6:16-18
My doctrine is not Mine, but His who sent Me.
If anyone wills to do His will, he shall know concerning the doctrine, whether it is from God
or whether I speak of My own authority.

HE WHO SPEAKES FROM HIMSELF SEEKS HIS OWN GLORY;

But he who seeks the glory of the One who sent Him is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.


macca

[Justaned]

"MACCA
HOW ON EARTH IS HE LEADING PEOPLE AWAY FROM JESUS AND THE PURITY OF THE GOSPEL????????HE PREACHES JESUS AND HIM CRUCIFIED??????" Yes but in Jimmy's cross theology it is twisted and confusing.
I am not sure what MACCA 's answer is But I think I know what he is saying.
Jimmy theology is one of sanctification. I will try to break down his theology, so bare with me. I hope it will not take to long to do.
OK, First of all Jimmy claims this revelation came directly from God to him, this is the first RED FLAG almost reminiscent of all cult leaders. (I know, an outlandish claim But that's what he is in my humble opinion)
The theology is this, as I said in a previous reply, The born again believer will be ruled by the sin nature unless he puts his faith in exclusively in the cross. Now this statement is very vague to say the least.
Then he goes on to say the cross must be the ever object of our faith in order for the Holy spirit to work in our lives, and through faith in the cross we get this victory over the sin nature. Jimmy uses this to explain his actions in the 80s and 90s by saying in his book the reason why he did what he did is because he didn't understand the cross. But the bible says a "man is drawn away by his own lust", go and sin no more Jimmy, its not rocket science, The statements that jimmy says are not found in scripture. Dake's teaching on sanctification and Jimmy's is completely different. Just read Romans chapter 7 in the DARB and and then Jimmy's commentary Bible in that same chapter and you will see what I am talking about.
Also pertaining to salvation in Jimmy's cross theology its the same you cannot be saved unless you put your faith in the cross, but the bible says put your faith is Jesus. Not just his crucifixion. The bible gives many aspects about Jesus that one is suppose to put their faith in. Here is just a few:
1 in him being the son of God
2 that he came in the flesh
3 the virgin birth
4 that he is the messiah
5 that he was crucified
6 Resurrected
7 Ascended
8 That he is coming back
Basically ones faith must be put in Jesus, in who he is, what he did and all that entails, not just the crucifixion only or the Cross that Jesus was crucified on.
His whole Expositors bible is completely centered around his theology, the meat of it is "the cross". I believe Jimmy has an agenda, it is to either justify or excuse his actions so he can continue on Television and make that money or else he would have to get a real job, (Oops sorry that was the bad Rocky). The denomination that he was affiliated with wanted him to under go treatment and their process of restoration before he started preaching again. That's why on his TV channel all he does is knock other churches and other denomination. Jimmy did not want submit to what the Assemblies of God wanted him to do to, he wanted it his way. He continued preaching through his fall and never stopped. Oh yes, he was off TV for while, but still continued to minister, so it never was a fall so to speak, he never stepped down. This theology came about in 97, only 6 years after the incident that the assemblies of God wanted to deal with, and this was not an isolated incident, it happen over a period of years. The misconception here is that Jimmy stepped down, he never did. He did lose some of his followers, but he still continued preaching through it all. Now this is my opinion. But this is also coming from a couple years worth of study. I was very much into him and studied his teachings, until I believe the Lord gave me discernment about this. I believe in restoration but not in this way, And not with an underlined agenda. In the end its all about the Money.

Preach it Rocky!

You are right on!

[Watchman2013]

Rocky,

God Bless You, Sir. Well said.

One must say, Jimmy does, indeed, cry World Class crocodile tears...

By their fruit, ye shall know them. To quote Al Gore, "Can the leopard change it's stripes?" (Yes. Yes, he did say, "stripes." Remember, too, that he invented the Internet...)

In twisting and misapplying The Scriptures, and plagiarizing Reverend Dake (my favorite expositor of The Word), "Reverend Jimmy Swaggart" needs to truly confess his sins, truly repent, and ask God for His Forgiveness. Then, he should seek God, and ask Him what to do... Our God is the God of Second Chances, or more, as He Wills... To me, Jimmy is damaged goods, but with God, all things are possible...

Again, Rocky, thank-you...

Maranatha

Watchman2013

[branham1965]

that stinks Rocky

"MACCA
HOW ON EARTH IS HE LEADING PEOPLE AWAY FROM JESUS AND THE PURITY OF THE GOSPEL????????HE PREACHES JESUS AND HIM CRUCIFIED??????" Yes but in Jimmy's cross theology it is twisted and confusing.
I am not sure what MACCA 's answer is But I think I know what he is saying.
Jimmy theology is one of sanctification. I will try to break down his theology, so bare with me. I hope it will not take to long to do.
OK, First of all Jimmy claims this revelation came directly from God to him, this is the first RED FLAG almost reminiscent of all cult leaders. (I know, an outlandish claim But that's what he is in my humble opinion)
The theology is this, as I said in a previous reply, The born again believer will be ruled by the sin nature unless he puts his faith in exclusively in the cross. Now this statement is very vague to say the least.
Then he goes on to say the cross must be the ever object of our faith in order for the Holy spirit to work in our lives, and through faith in the cross we get this victory over the sin nature. Jimmy uses this to explain his actions in the 80s and 90s by saying in his book the reason why he did what he did is because he didn't understand the cross. But the bible says a "man is drawn away by his own lust", go and sin no more Jimmy, its not rocket science, The statements that jimmy says are not found in scripture. Dake's teaching on sanctification and Jimmy's is completely different. Just read Romans chapter 7 in the DARB and and then Jimmy's commentary Bible in that same chapter and you will see what I am talking about.
Also pertaining to salvation in Jimmy's cross theology its the same you cannot be saved unless you put your faith in the cross, but the bible says put your faith is Jesus. Not just his crucifixion. The bible gives many aspects about Jesus that one is suppose to put their faith in. Here is just a few:
1 in him being the son of God
2 that he came in the flesh
3 the virgin birth
4 that he is the messiah
5 that he was crucified
6 Resurrected
7 Ascended
8 That he is coming back
Basically ones faith must be put in Jesus, in who he is, what he did and all that entails, not just the crucifixion only or the Cross that Jesus was crucified on.
His whole Expositors bible is completely centered around his theology, the meat of it is "the cross". I believe Jimmy has an agenda, it is to either justify or excuse his actions so he can continue on Television and make that money or else he would have to get a real job, (Oops sorry that was the bad Rocky). The denomination that he was affiliated with wanted him to under go treatment and their process of restoration before he started preaching again. That's why on his TV channel all he does is knock other churches and other denomination. Jimmy did not want submit to what the Assemblies of God wanted him to do to, he wanted it his way. He continued preaching through his fall and never stopped. Oh yes, he was off TV for while, but still continued to minister, so it never was a fall so to speak, he never stepped down. This theology came about in 97, only 6 years after the incident that the assemblies of God wanted to deal with, and this was not an isolated incident, it happen over a period of years. The misconception here is that Jimmy stepped down, he never did. He did lose some of his followers, but he still continued preaching through it all. Now this is my opinion. But this is also coming from a couple years worth of study. I was very much into him and studied his teachings, until I believe the Lord gave me discernment about this. I believe in restoration but not in this way, And not with an underlined agenda. In the end its all about the Money.

[branham1965]

YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO JUDGE HIM THAT WAY.

MY PASTOR WOULD ASK YOU ... WHERE ARE YOU FRUITS????WHO ARE YOU????HOW MANY THOUSANDS HAVE YOU LED TO CHRIST????
THAT WAS HIM.RIP.

FRANKLIN GRAHAM CALLED BROTHER SWAGGART AND THANKED HIM FOR PREACHING THE CROSS.
OF COURSE TO THE CRITICAL SPIRIT CROWD THATS A JOKE.
SOME PEOPLE HAVE THE SHOCK OF THEIR EXISTENCE COMING MATT 7

Rocky,

God Bless You, Sir. Well said.

One must say, Jimmy does, indeed, cry World Class crocodile tears...

By their fruit, ye shall know them. To quote Al Gore, "Can the leopard change it's stripes?" (Yes. Yes, he did say, "stripes." Remember, too, that he invented the Internet...)

In twisting and misapplying The Scriptures, and plagiarizing Reverend Dake (my favorite expositor of The Word), "Reverend Jimmy Swaggart" needs to truly confess his sins, truly repent, and ask God for His Forgiveness. Then, he should seek God, and ask Him what to do... Our God is the God of Second Chances, or more, as He Wills... To me, Jimmy is damaged goods, but with God, all things are possible...

Again, Rocky, thank-you...

Maranatha

Watchman2013

[macca]

"MACCA
HOW ON EARTH IS HE LEADING PEOPLE AWAY FROM JESUS AND THE PURITY OF THE GOSPEL????????HE PREACHES JESUS AND HIM CRUCIFIED??????" Yes but in Jimmy's cross theology it is twisted and confusing.
I am not sure what MACCA 's answer is But I think I know what he is saying.
Jimmy theology is one of sanctification. I will try to break down his theology, so bare with me. I hope it will not take to long to do.
OK, First of all Jimmy claims this revelation came directly from God to him, this is the first RED FLAG almost reminiscent of all cult leaders. (I know, an outlandish claim But that's what he is in my humble opinion)
The theology is this, as I said in a previous reply, The born again believer will be ruled by the sin nature unless he puts his faith in exclusively in the cross. Now this statement is very vague to say the least.
Then he goes on to say the cross must be the ever object of our faith in order for the Holy spirit to work in our lives, and through faith in the cross we get this victory over the sin nature. Jimmy uses this to explain his actions in the 80s and 90s by saying in his book the reason why he did what he did is because he didn't understand the cross. But the bible says a "man is drawn away by his own lust", go and sin no more Jimmy, its not rocket science, The statements that jimmy says are not found in scripture. Dake's teaching on sanctification and Jimmy's is completely different. Just read Romans chapter 7 in the DARB and and then Jimmy's commentary Bible in that same chapter and you will see what I am talking about.
Also pertaining to salvation in Jimmy's cross theology its the same you cannot be saved unless you put your faith in the cross, but the bible says put your faith is Jesus. Not just his crucifixion. The bible gives many aspects about Jesus that one is suppose to put their faith in. Here is just a few:
1 in him being the son of God
2 that he came in the flesh
3 the virgin birth
4 that he is the messiah
5 that he was crucified
6 Resurrected
7 Ascended
8 That he is coming back
Basically ones faith must be put in Jesus, in who he is, what he did and all that entails, not just the crucifixion only or the Cross that Jesus was crucified on.
His whole Expositors bible is completely centered around his theology, the meat of it is "the cross". I believe Jimmy has an agenda, it is to either justify or excuse his actions so he can continue on Television and make that money or else he would have to get a real job, (Oops sorry that was the bad Rocky). The denomination that he was affiliated with wanted him to under go treatment and their process of restoration before he started preaching again. That's why on his TV channel all he does is knock other churches and other denomination. Jimmy did not want submit to what the Assemblies of God wanted him to do to, he wanted it his way. He continued preaching through his fall and never stopped. Oh yes, he was off TV for while, but still continued to minister, so it never was a fall so to speak, he never stepped down. This theology came about in 97, only 6 years after the incident that the assemblies of God wanted to deal with, and this was not an isolated incident, it happen over a period of years. The misconception here is that Jimmy stepped down, he never did. He did lose some of his followers, but he still continued preaching through it all. Now this is my opinion. But this is also coming from a couple years worth of study. I was very much into him and studied his teachings, until I believe the Lord gave me discernment about this. I believe in restoration but not in this way, And not with an underlined agenda. In the end its all about the Money.

Thank you Rocky, you know more than i do about this problem in the body of Christ... well said.

As to your question Billy of Jimmy leading people astray, because his message is corrupt it spreads throughout his whole ministry.

Paul said.
2 Cor. 11- 14-15;
And no marvel; for satan himself is transformed into an angel of light.
Therefore it is no great thing if his ministers also be transformed as ministers of righteousness; whose end shall be according to their works.

Read Dake's notes f col 4 on this " marks of false ministers in 2 cor,

These people are not listening to the voice of Jesus at all, they would not know Jesus's voice if He was speaking to them face to face.. John 10:

Jimmy is the voice they listen to now days.


macca
macca