Dake Bible Discussion BoardHow do you measure faith?

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luchnia
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How do you measure faith?

Post by luchnia »

As the title states, how do you measure faith? If we believe what is stated in Romans 12:3 then we believe that every man "...according as God had dealt to every man the measure of faith."

There are many questions that can be asked of this text such as:
Does the measure of faith inclusive of all men that have lived throughout time, or simply limited to "...every man that is among you..."?
What is the measure of faith?
How does one measure faith and what do they measure it with?
Is it limited to belief in God, or is it simply the ability to believe in anything you desire?

Romans 12:3 (KJV)
3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.


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Hill Top
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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by Hill Top »

luchnia wrote:
Sun Dec 26, 2021 6:21 am
As the title states, how do you measure faith? If we believe what is stated in Romans 12:3 then we believe that every man "...according as God had dealt to every man the measure of faith."

There are many questions that can be asked of this text such as:
Does the measure of faith inclusive of all men that have lived throughout time, or simply limited to "...every man that is among you..."?
What is the measure of faith?
How does one measure faith and what do they measure it with?
Is it limited to belief in God, or is it simply the ability to believe in anything you desire?

Romans 12:3 (KJV)
3 For I say, through the grace given unto me, to every man that is among you, not to think of himself more highly than he ought to think; but to think soberly, according as God hath dealt to every man the measure of faith.
Faith is measured by actions related to what the faith concerns.
If a man has faith that ice is thick enough to walk on, he will walk on it.



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Zechariah
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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by Bible Reader »

Measure faith??? You either believe and are born again or you aren't. God doesn't have any reheated step children.
If you are born again the Holy Spirit of God dwells in you, it is no longer faith it is knowing. If you don't know then get saved and born again.



Hill Top
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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by Hill Top »

I'm surprised luchnia hasn't revisited this yet.



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luchnia
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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by luchnia »

Hill Top wrote:
Thu Feb 17, 2022 9:28 pm
I'm surprised luchnia hasn't revisited this yet.
I don't get as much forum time this time of the year as I am getting my garden seedlings ready for my garden and a bunch of other work around here that I have to do before Spring gets here. The older I get I have to pace myself more so it takes longer. In my younger days I could knock this stuff out quickly. Age and gravity plays it part now days.


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luchnia
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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by luchnia »

Bible Reader wrote:
Mon Feb 14, 2022 6:45 pm
Measure faith??? You either believe and are born again or you aren't. God doesn't have any reheated step children.
If you are born again the Holy Spirit of God dwells in you, it is no longer faith it is knowing. If you don't know then get saved and born again.
I would say it is not that simple by any stretch. If it weren't then Jesus would have told us otherwise. Curious though, how much is knowing involved in trusting or the confidence that faith requires. Remember without faith it is impossible to please God. What type of faith does it take to please God?

Here is another thought about the various measures or types of faith. There is weak faith, wavering faith, mental faith, strong faith, active faith, temporary faith, divine faith, unfeigned faith, etc. I think it was three generations in Timothy's line that had unfeigned faith. That must have been an unshakable measure of confidence in her words being manifested in the earthly sphere.


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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by bibleman »

In God's Plan for Man Dake points out the BIBLICAL kinds of faith, or in some cases you could say "measures" of faith.
III. Kinds of Faith - There are several kinds of faith mentioned in Scripture, of which the following list will be helpful in arriving at the kind of faith one should have:

1. COMMON FAITH (Titus 1:4). It is called “the mutual faith” (Rom. 1:12). This is the faith that is common to all men who claim to be Christians.

2. WEAK FAITH (Rom. 4:19; 14:1-23; 15:1-4; 1 Cor. 8:1-13). This is the kind of faith that constantly limits personal benefits and privileges in the Gospel, due to wrong teachings and personal scruples concerning non-essentials of life.

3. STRONG FAITH (Rom. 4:20). This faith is the kind that refuses to be defeated. It refuses to take no for an answer. It laughs at circumstances, symptoms, all outward appearances, and what is seen, heard, or felt, and it doggedly holds to the fact that what has been asked of God is granted.

4. LITTLE FAITH (Mt. 6:30; 8:26; 14:31; Lk. 12:28). This is the same as no faith because it is the wavering kind (Heb. 10:23; Jas. 1:5-8).

5. GREAT FAITH (Mt. 8:10; 15:28). This is the true, unwavering faith that will always move God to answer according to His abundant promises (Heb. 11:6).

6. UNFEIGNED FAITH (1 Tim. 1:5; 2 Tim. 1:5). This faith is the kind that knows no hypocrisy, sham, or counterfeit. It is the kind that does not brag or put on an outward show that it is real. It is simply genuine and real and sincere in its every aspect. It proceeds out of a pure heart and from a good conscience, as stated in these Scriptures.

7. TEMPORARY FAITH (Lk. 8:13). This is the kind of faith that believes for a while and springs up like a mushroom, but because of shallowness or lack of root it fails in time of temptation and test.

8. HISTORICAL FAITH (1 Jn. 5:10-13). This is faith in the history or the record of God concerning the past and concerning His own work for men. One can believe the record of God to the letter and still not be saved. It is simply believing in the record of anything of the past. No consecration to God is necessary to believe history.

9. MENTAL FAITH (Jas. 2:14-26). Mental faith is similar to historical faith in that it believes history, but goes further and believes every part of the Bible, past, present, and future, as well as all the truths of the blessings of God, but it does not act upon the Word of God. Faith without works is dead, being alone. It is passive faith or mere mental assent to truth.

10. ACTIVE FAITH (Jas. 2:14-26; Heb. 10:19-38). This is the kind that acts upon the Word of God as it is made clear. James put it this way: “shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.” All men must have this faith to get anything from God. As long as faith is purely mental and passive no action will be taken to obey the truth.

11. WAVERING FAITH (Jas. 1:5-8). This is faith doubting God and refusing to believe. A wavering faith is called double-mindedness, a constant change of the mind as to what is wanted or whether the thing asked for is wanted or not. It is the attitude of yes—no, yes—no, and yes—no, until God Himself cannot tell whether it is yes or no. One minute it is decided that a thing is wanted, and it may be wanted with some real desperation, but the next minute it is not so important.

12. UNWAVERING FAITH (Heb. 10:23; 11:6). This is faith taking God at His Word without any question.

13. HUMAN FAITH (Mk. 11:22-24). This is simply the exercise of human faculties in having confidence and conviction that he can believe God, and that God is true to all that He has promised. All men are capable of faith in themselves and faith in anyone else that makes any statement of promise to them. Faith is an attribute of man's created being.

14. DIVINE FAITH (Heb. 11:3; Gal. 2:20). Faith is not only a natural attribute of man. It, also, is an attribute of God. It is God's absolute confidence and conviction in His own Being and Word.

Finis J. Dake, God's Plan for Man, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2004), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 504-509.


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Zechariah
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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by Bible Reader »

Faith is not positive thinking, denying the reality of your circumstance; Faith is denying these circumstance the right to remain in control of your life.
You either have faith or you don't.

The question on how to measure faith is asked when (Roman 8:28 And we know that God causes everything to work together for the good of those who love God and are called according to his purpose for them.) is questioned.



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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by bibleman »

Bible Reader wrote:
Sat Feb 19, 2022 10:56 pm
Faith is not positive thinking, denying the reality of your circumstance; Faith is denying these circumstance the right to remain in control of your life.
You either have faith or you don't.

The question on how to measure faith is asked when (Roman 8:28 And we know that God causes everything to work together for the good of those who love God and are called according to his purpose for them.) is questioned.
Well did Peter have faith or did he NOT have faith?

Matthew 14:27 But straightway Jesus spake unto them, saying, Be of good cheer; it is I; be not afraid.
28 And Peter answered him and said, Lord, if it be thou, bid me come unto thee on the water.
29 And he said, Come. And when Peter was come down out of the ship, he walked on the water, to go to Jesus.
30 But when he saw the wind boisterous, he was afraid; and beginning to sink, he cried, saying, Lord, save me.
31 And immediately Jesus stretched forth his hand, and caught him, and said unto him, O thou of little faith, wherefore didst thou doubt?


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The fault in Bible complications is not with God or the Bible, but with men who refuse to believe what God says and think we have to interpret what He says in order to get the meaning. Dake Bible -Mark 11:17 note

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Ironman
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Re: How do you measure faith?

Post by Ironman »

Is it even possible to measure faith? Peter knew Jesus personally and yet when things got tough, and he was tested, Peter was a backslider;

Peter was a true follower of Christ and yet he was also a back slider.

Matt. 26:58; "But Peter followed him afar off unto the high priest's palace, and went in, and sat with the servants, to see the end."

1. In verse Matt. 26:33 ; Pr. 16:18, he boasted.

2. Made Christ a lier (v 33-35)

3. Slept instead of praying (v 40)

4. Failed to moritify the flesh (v 41)

5. Relied on the arm of flesh (v 51)

6. Forsook Christ and fled (v 56)

7. Followed afar off (v 58)

8. Sat with the Lords enemies (v 58)

9. Gave up hope-discouraged (v 58)

10. became afraid of men (v 69-74)

11. Lied (v 69-74)

12 Cursed (v 69-74)

Jesus had predicted his backsliding and RE-CONVERSION (Luke 22:31-34). Peter was a saved man who lost his salvation, repented and was re-converted.

v.31, And the Lord said, Simon, Simon, behold, Satan hath desired to have you, that he may sift you as wheat:

32, But I have prayed for thee, that thy faith fail not: and when thou art converted, strengthen thy brethren.

33, And he said unto him, Lord, I am ready to go with thee, both into prison, and to death.

34, And he said, I tell thee, Peter, the cock shall not crow this day, before that thou shalt thrice deny that thou knowest me.

Peter denied Jesus before men three times.

Jesus said anyone who denies Me before men, I shall deny them before My Father

Mat 10:33, But whosoever shall deny me before men, him will I also deny before my Father which is in heaven.

Luke 22: 60-62, And Peter said, Man, I know not what thou sayest. And immediately, while he yet spake, the cock crew.


61, And the Lord turned, and looked upon Peter. And Peter remembered the word of the Lord, how he had said unto him, Before the cock crow, thou shalt deny me thrice.

62, And Peter went out, and wept bitterly

Had Peter not wept bitterly and repented, where do you think He would have ended up after death?

God wants all men to be saved, if they want to be saved. God forces no one to be saved, stay saved, or love Him. Once saved, God says we must endure to the end, in other words, resist temptation

Matthew 10:22, And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that ENDURETH to the end shall be saved.

1 Timothy 2:4, Who will have all men to be saved, and to come unto the knowledge of the truth.

Christs own words of warning to the saved;

Matthew 26:41, Watch ye and pray, that ye enter not into temptation: the spirit indeed is willing, but the flesh is weak.

Mark 14:38, Watch ye and pray, LEST YE ENTER TEMPTATION. The spirit truly is ready, but the flesh is weak.


Galatians 4: 16, Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

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