Dake Bible Discussion Board ⇒ First John chapter 1,fellowship vs relationship?

[raymond5555]

Only by the cleansing power of Jesus Christ's .blood,death ,burial and resurrection makes such fellowship and relationship a reality. First John 1:9,First Corinthians 15:3-4.

[Grandfather]

Some advocates of unconditional security makes a distinction between the terms fellowship with God and relationship to God and claim that fellowship with God can be severed,but not the relationship with God. This distinction cannot be proven by scripture.No person who fails to walk in the light and truly practice the truth can rightly claim to be in a relationship with God.First John 1:5-7.

I am trying to follow this thread/concept and I am finding it very difficult to grasp the point you are trying to make. You keep saying "some advocates" which, by implication means there are other advocates that do not hold that same view.

Perhaps you can illustrate your point of relationship vs. fellowship using the story of the Prodigal Son. To the father, the son was always a son, he was a lost son, but a son nevertheless. (the relationship was unbroken) The son that stayed home, while still having a relationship had no deep fellowship with the father. (fellowship broken)

Now, you can take it from there and explain what you mean.

[raymond5555]

Question?Do you use a Fake Bible?

[raymond5555]

Dake bible

[raymond5555]

The topic of fellowship and relationship ?If a person is born again,saved,I'm saying that fellowship and relationship to God is the same thing.Very simple concept.There are false bible teachers that teach they are not the same thing.Some false teachers teach unconditional security,once saved always saved.And they teach to prove their point of this false doctrine that a person can have sin their life,and they say these persons are out of fellowship with God,but there still saved and are still in relationship with God.I'm saying and the bible teaches you can fall away and be lost and you break fellowship and relationship with God.

[Grandfather]

The topic of fellowship and relationship ?If a person is born again,saved,I'm saying that fellowship and relationship to God is the same thing.Very simple concept.There are false bible teachers that teach they are not the same thing.Some false teachers teach unconditional security,once saved always saved.And they teach to prove their point of this false doctrine that a person can have sin their life,and they say these persons are out of fellowship with God,but there still saved and are still in relationship with God.I'm saying and the bible teaches you can fall away and be lost and you break fellowship and relationship with God.

Okay, you call them, relationship and fellowship, the same thing. Does these teachers you label as "false teachers" the same way?

BTW - I do not believe RELATIONSHIP and FELLOWSHIP are necessarily the same thing. They can be, but they do not have to be. A person can have a "relationship" with the Lord, perhaps it is that of a son or daughter. Perhaps it is the relationship of a servant and a master, or perhaps that of a friend, or distance acquaintance. Those are some of ways I would define and describe as a relationship.

FELLOWSHIP is different. To me, fellowship implies a deeper relationship. An overly simplistic example is the "two fellows in the same ship" concept. Fellowship, again to me, implies a mutual commitment to each other.

For me, Fellowship implies a relationship, but a relationship does not imply fellowship

[raymond5555]

Thanks for your thoughts! Do you use a dake bible?

[Grandfather]

Thanks for your thoughts! Do you use a dake bible?

I own a several of Dake's works and I do reference them.

However, I do not raise any of Dake's comments to the authority of that given to scripture. Dake's comments, notes, use of scripture are just that, they are the opinion of Dake, even the scripture he uses to support his interpretation are support in his opinion. Sometimes I believe he is right, sometimes I think he is close, sometimes I think he is challenging, and other times I think he needs to be challenged.

[raymond5555]

[Hill Top]

Fellowship with God is relationship with God.

Dis-fellowship with God produces proof of dis-relationship with God.
I understand that folks say "out of fellowship" as an alternative to saying "in sin".
Sin shows one is not born of God, so a sinner is not "related" to God. (1 John 3:9-10)