Dake Bible Discussion BoardDivine Healing Technician Training Course

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Spiritblade Disciple
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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:50 pm

TruthSeeker wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 4:25 pm
Truth seeker wrote
"One can doubt in their head and believe in their heart."

After writing that statement, I had a check on the inside. Jesus said in Luke 12:29 "..neither be ye of doubtful mind".

I'm not sure if one can have faith in their heart but yet doubt in their mind. It is a statement I've heard more than once in church but I'm not sure if it is backed up by scripture.
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 6:14 pm
I think there is "heart faith" and "head faith." And, that the two are not the same. Ideally having both is best.
TruthSeeker wrote:
Wed Feb 06, 2019 10:45 am
Thanks for your response. I agree having both is best. Based on Galatians 3:22-25 I'm not sure for those in the O.T. if it was possible for them to have the same heart faith as those after Pentecost. Even if it was only head faith they had in the O.T., based on Hebrews 11 they did more mighty things with the faith they had then many of us Christians do in the new covenant. That needs to change and I believe it is going to.


You're welcome, Truthseeker.

I believe that it was possible for those in the Old Testament to have the same heart faith as those after Pentecost. I agree with Dake that many received the new birth prior to Pentecost. And, there were several that had much greater measures of the Spirit than those that (in my opinion, falsely) claim to be baptized with the Spirit, today.

I agree with you that folks need to do better under the New Covenant. After all, how shall they escape if they do not?


Acts 10:42-43 King James Version
"And He commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is He which was ordained of God to be the Judge of Quick and Dead. To Him give all the Prophets witness, that through His Name WHOSEVER BELIEVETH IN HIM SHALL RECEIVE REMISSION OF SINS."

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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:30 pm

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 8:21 pm
Why would a person who has done all of the above refuse to be water baptized, if possible?
It would seem to me that water baptism is one of Christ's commandments and that failure to obey the commandment to be water baptized would be sinful. What could be worse than refusing to publicly identify with Christ in His death and resurrection through water baptism? How long could a so-called Christian claim to be a Christian without being water baptized assuming there were no impediments preventing his water baptism?

Hill Top wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:59 pm
Why?
Because someone told them it wasn't necessary!

Thank you Spiritblade for posting the doctrine of rev Dake.
His concluding paragraph nullifies the entirety of the document.

Just to be clear, the portion quoted above was written by me, not Dake. And, I don't see it as nullifying Dake's position in the two quoted sections. Instead, I see it as the natural extrapolation of what Dake wrote. Those that know to do good and don't do it are sinners. Those that know they ought to be baptized and refuse aren't Christians.


Acts 10:42-43 King James Version
"And He commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is He which was ordained of God to be the Judge of Quick and Dead. To Him give all the Prophets witness, that through His Name WHOSEVER BELIEVETH IN HIM SHALL RECEIVE REMISSION OF SINS."

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luchnia
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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by luchnia » Sat Feb 09, 2019 7:37 am

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:50 pm
I believe that it was possible for those in the Old Testament to have the same heart faith as those after Pentecost. I agree with Dake that many received the new birth prior to Pentecost. And, there were several that had much greater measures of the Spirit than those that (in my opinion, falsely) claim to be baptized with the Spirit, today.

I agree with you that folks need to do better under the New Covenant. After all, how shall they escape if they do not?
This is my view as well. As a matter of fact, I wonder how folks can even question the OT new birth experience and the greater measures of the Spirit that were demonstrated by the great men of faith.

I, as you, believe that many that claim to be baptized with the Spirit today are making false claims. It is my opinion that they do not know how the Holy Spirit works. From what I have found many are ignorant as stumps when it comes to understanding the Holy Spirit.

One study I go to is slightly Pentecostal slanted and they are "holy ghosters" so to state, although not as lively as some Pentecostal churches are. This group does not fall out and wallow on the floor with vocal babbling while having animal like seizures. In most cases what I have found is that it really depends on one's background in various churches and to how others act before them as to how they lean as far as their understanding and experience of the Holy Spirit, however that does not change their ignorance about the Spirit.


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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by TruthSeeker » Sat Feb 09, 2019 11:03 am

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:28 pm
TruthSeeker wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 4:17 pm
God is no respecter of persons... He is only a respecter of faith.
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Mon Feb 04, 2019 6:42 pm
Interesting. But, perhaps, not quite accurate.
TruthSeeker wrote:
Tue Feb 05, 2019 10:42 am
The above statement is perhaps interesting to the over analytical and religious mind but to the just that shall live by faith it is exciting! Not only exciting but very accurate. "... and without faith it is impossible to please God" Hebrews 11:6. To me that is pretty straight forward to what God respects.


Does the Bible anywhere say that "the UNJUST shall live by faith alone"? What scripture shows that the UNJUST shall live by faith alone?

Certainly, it is impossible to please God without faith, but where does the Bible say that faith alone is pleasing to God?

Can you list one thing God respects in a person that did not come by faith?



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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by Hill Top » Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:28 pm

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:28 pm
Does the Bible anywhere say that "the UNJUST shall live by faith alone"? What scripture shows that the UNJUST shall live by faith alone?

Certainly, it is impossible to please God without faith, but where does the Bible say that faith alone is pleasing to God?
The only place I could find the words "faith" and "alone" in the same verse was..."Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone." (James 2:17)
Faith is manifested by deeds.



Hill Top
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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by Hill Top » Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:35 pm

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 10:50 pm
You're welcome, Truthseeker.

I believe that it was possible for those in the Old Testament to have the same heart faith as those after Pentecost. I agree with Dake that many received the new birth prior to Pentecost. And, there were several that had much greater measures of the Spirit than those that (in my opinion, falsely) claim to be baptized with the Spirit, today.
Can you detail how rev Dake says men could be reborn in the OT?
Perhaps you could provide the names of those he says were reborn?



Hill Top
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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by Hill Top » Sat Feb 09, 2019 9:39 pm

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 11:30 pm
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 8:21 pm
Why would a person who has done all of the above refuse to be water baptized, if possible?
It would seem to me that water baptism is one of Christ's commandments and that failure to obey the commandment to be water baptized would be sinful. What could be worse than refusing to publicly identify with Christ in His death and resurrection through water baptism? How long could a so-called Christian claim to be a Christian without being water baptized assuming there were no impediments preventing his water baptism?
Hill Top wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 9:59 pm
Why?
Because someone told them it wasn't necessary!

Thank you Spiritblade for posting the doctrine of rev Dake.
His concluding paragraph nullifies the entirety of the document.
Just to be clear, the portion quoted above was written by me, not Dake. And, I don't see it as nullifying Dake's position in the two quoted sections. Instead, I see it as the natural extrapolation of what Dake wrote. Those that know to do good and don't do it are sinners. Those that know they ought to be baptized and refuse aren't Christians.
Thank you for that clarification.
Rev Dake infers that water baptism isn't necessary for salvation, and I can't agree.
It seems you can't agree either.



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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:20 pm

luchnia wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 6:33 am
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Thu Feb 07, 2019 9:13 pm
I think living faith can be seen in a person that takes action based upon what they believe. I think the will is active in deciding in whether or not to act on one's beliefs.
And immediately when Jesus perceived in His spirit that they so reasoned within themselves,
Thanks Spiritblade, good points.

The verse above is one of those verses that indicate how one must perceive such things, or at least in Jesus case which I think is also how we must perceive.

This was the concept I was referring to in another post about discernment, but a question remains, is the same perception in a man's spirit required to determine faith needed for healing or are there supporting scriptures that show otherwise? Was that how Jesus knew to heal the one brought by the faith of others, or was it simply because of their pressing action?

I think the mind of man cannot do this discernment alone. It must be the whole of the components working together. Sort of like an engine has to fire on all cylinders to work properly. What are your thoughts?

I think that seeing the actions of the four bringing him to Him was the same as seeing the faith of the four. What difference is there between faith and action?

Is the same spiritual perception needed to determine whom we ought to heal? To that question, I ask to whom was Elias sent? Faith alone isn't enough to warrant receiving healing. Grace must come first. It is by grace through faith. Not faith alone.


Acts 10:42-43 King James Version
"And He commanded us to preach unto the people, and to testify that it is He which was ordained of God to be the Judge of Quick and Dead. To Him give all the Prophets witness, that through His Name WHOSEVER BELIEVETH IN HIM SHALL RECEIVE REMISSION OF SINS."

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luchnia
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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by luchnia » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:18 am

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Sun Feb 10, 2019 7:20 pm
I think that seeing the actions of the four bringing him to Him was the same as seeing the faith of the four. What difference is there between faith and action?

Is the same spiritual perception needed to determine whom we ought to heal? To that question, I ask to whom was Elias sent? Faith alone isn't enough to warrant receiving healing. Grace must come first. It is by grace through faith. Not faith alone.
So it would seem there is no one size fits all when it comes to healing. You have the woman with the issue that was healed on her faith where Jesus perceived that virtue went from Him, but with these four men it would seem it was their faith that got their friend healed, then you also have the message in James where it implies the faith of the righteous is enough.

You bring up grace, but yet if in some cases healing is by one's faith. Is mercy a given since there might not be anything mentioned in the context that shows that mercy must be there such as the woman who touched His garment and was immediately healed? We also have healing that occurred because a word was spoken, or someone was touched, or simply by someone's faith and so on. In the case of the one man's daughter it seemed to entirely rely on the man's faith and no one else. Scripture says something along the lines of speak the word only and we do know she was healed in that selfsame hour that the word was spoken

I am curious how the Divine Healing Technician Training Course approaches these questionable things. I think that will go a long way in determining the scriptural validity of the course. I did hear the man state in the first video that there were things missing in the bible and that they were adding the missing items. Of course we know "adding what is missing" is dangerous territory to tread.

I tend to look at things of God such as healing in a purpose and orderly manner of process. In other words even though there might be many aspects to healing, it all has to have a solid step through process at its root. The challenge to my understanding on this is that there are so many different cases that don't seem to follow a concise pattern.


Word up!

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luchnia
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Re: Divine Healing Technician Training Course

Post by luchnia » Mon Feb 11, 2019 7:35 am

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Feb 08, 2019 8:21 pm
Why would a person who has done all of the above refuse to be water baptized, if possible?
In my opinion, I don't think anyone who has been saved by the immersion into Christ would refuse the outward sign of the immersion in water at some point. Even though it is not required for salvation, it is still the right thing to do to outwardly signify the inward change in a person.

Any saint of God would want to illustrate to all, the cleansing that happened to the inward man at conversion. It sort of reminds me of how important our light is to the world. We would be wrong to put a bowl over the light then none could see it. I have seen many get water baptized and always have enjoyed the occasion and the special moment when one comes up out of the water.


Word up!

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