Dake Bible Discussion BoardIs disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

General Discussion Forum devoted to the study of God's Word in Honor of Finis J. Dake.
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branham1965
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Re: Is disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

Post by branham1965 » Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:57 am

Just as there is the Church of God and the appointed Ministers of the Lord Jesus Christ

there are false teachers ,false ministers yielding to deceiving spirits hurting the people and teaching doctrines of devils.1 Timothy 4.These spirits are very religious and zealous and seduce many people.

Rev.Kenneth E. Hagin said religious spirits were THE HARDEST devils to cast out of people.
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:52 pm
branham1965 wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:31 pm
I think you might be missing my point.Peter and Paul were Apostles of Jesus Christ.

When there were issues in the early Church they went to the God ordained leaders of the Church cf Acts 15. In the order of the New Testament Church (Ephesians 4) is for those in Spiritual Authority - the Elders,the Presbytery and especially the Pastor are the ones to do the correcting and helping today.


Not laymen and unknown strangers on a Bible board.

The cults say the same thing about "helping" others.They are trying to save our souls ie they are all right and we are all wrong,we need to buy into their bill of goods etc.etc.
This begs the following questions:

1. How do you know which church is the True Church of the Living God?
2. How do you know who are truly God ordained elders of the True Church of the Living God?
3. Is such a church universal? Or, does it only exist when true Christians meet in person?
— 3B. How do you know who is a true Christian?
4. If laymen and strangers on a Bible board cannot help one another, what is the point of this board?
Last edited by branham1965 on Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:01 am, edited 2 times in total.



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luchnia
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Re: Is disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

Post by luchnia » Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:59 am

branham1965 wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:31 pm
I think you might be missing my point.Peter and Paul were Apostles of Jesus Christ.

When there were issues in the early Church they went to the God ordained leaders of the Church cf Acts 15. In the order of the New Testament Church (Ephesians 4) is for those in Spiritual Authority - the Elders,the Presbytery and especially the Pastor are the ones to do the correcting and helping today.


Not laymen and unknown strangers on a Bible board.

The cults say the same thing about "helping" others.They are trying to save our souls ie they are all right and we are all wrong,we need to buy into their bill of goods etc.etc.
You make some interesting points, however I think the layman table waiter Stephen would argue and challenge your points, not to mention the 120 at Pentacost and as many as were afar off that were called that received, and many, many scriptures such as 2 Tim 3:16, Acts 2, Romans chap 13, John chap 14, etc.

What is the call that makes a man an apostle of Jesus Christ or a workman rightly handling the Word? What is spiritual authority and whom does it belong? Which of today's pastors own the authority that comes from God? Which are God ordained? How do you determine such? Is it by judging their teaching and fruit?


Word up!

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branham1965
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Re: Is disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

Post by branham1965 » Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:18 am

Reverend Dake was for real .He bore many fruits for the Lord.Rod Parsley endorses his Bible.As does Joyce Meyer and Marilyn Hickey and many others.

My late Pastor was a student of his Bible and ministered in over 48 nations .Real Preachers with fruitful Ministries read after Reverend Dake = Dad Hagin,Kenneth Copeland and many others.

REVEREND DAKE WAS A PROVEN GOD CALLED GOD ORDAINED MINISTER OF JESUS CHRIST.HE HAD FRUITS AND FRUITS AND FRUITS.HIS WORKS HELPED UNTOLD MULTITUDES LEARN THE TRUTH AND TO MINISTER IT THEMSELVES.

I remember when the heretic hunters started.They attacked ALL the Proof Producing Ministries.
These folks attacked REVEREND DAKE and slandered the man of God and his works.

REVEREND DAKE WAS A TRUE CHRISTIAN LEADER ,BIBLE SCHOLAR AND A MINISTRY GIFT TO THE BODY OF CHRIST.

AND HE BEING DEAD YET SPEAKETH.
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:13 pm
Ironman wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 7:08 pm
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:52 pm
branham1965 wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:31 pm
I think you might be missing my point.Peter and Paul were Apostles of Jesus Christ.

When there were issues in the early Church they went to the God ordained leaders of the Church cf Acts 15. In the order of the New Testament Church (Ephesians 4) is for those in Spiritual Authority - the Elders,the Presbytery and especially the Pastor are the ones to do the correcting and helping today.


Not laymen and unknown strangers on a Bible board.

The cults say the same thing about "helping" others.They are trying to save our souls ie they are all right and we are all wrong,we need to buy into their bill of goods etc.etc.
This begs the following questions:

1. How do you know which church is the True Church of the Living God?
2. How do you know who are truly God ordained elders of the True Church of the Living God?
3. Is such a church universal? Or, does it only exist when true Christians meet in person?
— 3B. How do you know who is a true Christian?
4. If laymen and strangers on a Bible board cannot help one another, what is the point of this board?
God's true church by Finus Jennings Dake.

Jesus Christs church is not a building or a particular religious group with some special name? The new Testament Church, of which Jesus Christ is the head is a called out body of people of all nations who have been born again and who have lived a true Christian life and died in the faith. It also includes all those who are alive in Christ today. This present church is called the "ekklesia" of the New Testament times, called out of this world to evangelize the world in this age.

The church, in its largest signification is the whole company of redeemed in all ages, in Heaven and in Earth (Eph. 3:1-11; Heb. 12:23). It is the spiritual people who have been made members of the universial family of God. The church in this sense is the body of Christ, and it does not consist of saved and unsaved. It is not a group of individuals associated together for social and benevolent purposes, as seems to be on every hand in most worldly church gatherings. It is the body of people indwelt by God through the Holy Spirit and through whom God works in the world.
Great quote, Haz.

But, it only carries weight if Dake was a true Christian that was a truly God ordained elder in the True Church of the Living God. And, even then, he's still a stranger to those that didn't personally know him.
Last edited by branham1965 on Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:53 am, edited 1 time in total.



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branham1965
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Re: Is disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

Post by branham1965 » Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:50 am

Hello luchnia,

Stephen was under the authority of the Apostles and the Jerusalem Church.
Acts 6.He had signs and wonders in his ministry verse 6.
He was a Proof Producer.He had fruits.

He was the first martyr.He was a good man full of the Holy Ghost who had the face of an angel and the religious (spirited) leaders could not resist the Spirit or wisdom by which he spoke.

The 120 and all Bible believers are to be under spiritual authority.




luchnia wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:59 am
branham1965 wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:31 pm
I think you might be missing my point.Peter and Paul were Apostles of Jesus Christ.

When there were issues in the early Church they went to the God ordained leaders of the Church cf Acts 15. In the order of the New Testament Church (Ephesians 4) is for those in Spiritual Authority - the Elders,the Presbytery and especially the Pastor are the ones to do the correcting and helping today.


Not laymen and unknown strangers on a Bible board.

The cults say the same thing about "helping" others.They are trying to save our souls ie they are all right and we are all wrong,we need to buy into their bill of goods etc.etc.
You make some interesting points, however I think the layman table waiter Stephen would argue and challenge your points, not to mention the 120 at Pentacost and as many as were afar off that were called that received, and many, many scriptures such as 2 Tim 3:16, Acts 2, Romans chap 13, John chap 14, etc.

What is the call that makes a man an apostle of Jesus Christ or a workman rightly handling the Word? What is spiritual authority and whom does it belong? Which of today's pastors own the authority that comes from God? Which are God ordained? How do you determine such? Is it by judging their teaching and fruit?



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luchnia
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Re: Is disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

Post by luchnia » Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:01 am

branham1965 wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:50 am
Hello luchnia,

Stephen was under the authority of the Apostles and the Jerusalem Church.
Acts 6.He had signs and wonders in his ministry verse 6.
He was a Proof Producer.He had fruits.

He was the first martyr.He was a good man full of the Holy Ghost who had the face of an angel and the religious (spirited) leaders could not resist the Spirit or wisdom by which he spoke.

The 120 and all Bible believers are to be under spiritual authority.




luchnia wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:59 am
branham1965 wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:31 pm
I think you might be missing my point.Peter and Paul were Apostles of Jesus Christ.

When there were issues in the early Church they went to the God ordained leaders of the Church cf Acts 15. In the order of the New Testament Church (Ephesians 4) is for those in Spiritual Authority - the Elders,the Presbytery and especially the Pastor are the ones to do the correcting and helping today.


Not laymen and unknown strangers on a Bible board.

The cults say the same thing about "helping" others.They are trying to save our souls ie they are all right and we are all wrong,we need to buy into their bill of goods etc.etc.
You make some interesting points, however I think the layman table waiter Stephen would argue and challenge your points, not to mention the 120 at Pentacost and as many as were afar off that were called that received, and many, many scriptures such as 2 Tim 3:16, Acts 2, Romans chap 13, John chap 14, etc.

What is the call that makes a man an apostle of Jesus Christ or a workman rightly handling the Word? What is spiritual authority and whom does it belong? Which of today's pastors own the authority that comes from God? Which are God ordained? How do you determine such? Is it by judging their teaching and fruit?
So you would say you have no spiritual authority from God unless under an apostle of God? I would hate to think your answer would be no, because that would mean that you would have to accept everything a man said that spoke from a pulpit that claimed he was ordained of God.

Because a man claims he is of God, does not make it so, right? I mean there are probably hundreds of thousands that make such claims and you would have to obey them.


Word up!

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branham1965
Little Children, Let No Man Deceive You: He that Doeth Righteousness is Righteous, Even as He is Righteous
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Re: Is disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

Post by branham1965 » Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:15 am

I do not believe one has to be under an Apostle .


Reverend Dake gives the marks of a good Pastor in his notes on Saint John's gospel.


luchnia wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:01 am
branham1965 wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 7:50 am
Hello luchnia,

Stephen was under the authority of the Apostles and the Jerusalem Church.
Acts 6.He had signs and wonders in his ministry verse 6.
He was a Proof Producer.He had fruits.

He was the first martyr.He was a good man full of the Holy Ghost who had the face of an angel and the religious (spirited) leaders could not resist the Spirit or wisdom by which he spoke.

The 120 and all Bible believers are to be under spiritual authority.




luchnia wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 6:59 am
branham1965 wrote:
Wed Jan 02, 2019 6:31 pm
I think you might be missing my point.Peter and Paul were Apostles of Jesus Christ.

When there were issues in the early Church they went to the God ordained leaders of the Church cf Acts 15. In the order of the New Testament Church (Ephesians 4) is for those in Spiritual Authority - the Elders,the Presbytery and especially the Pastor are the ones to do the correcting and helping today.


Not laymen and unknown strangers on a Bible board.

The cults say the same thing about "helping" others.They are trying to save our souls ie they are all right and we are all wrong,we need to buy into their bill of goods etc.etc.
You make some interesting points, however I think the layman table waiter Stephen would argue and challenge your points, not to mention the 120 at Pentacost and as many as were afar off that were called that received, and many, many scriptures such as 2 Tim 3:16, Acts 2, Romans chap 13, John chap 14, etc.

What is the call that makes a man an apostle of Jesus Christ or a workman rightly handling the Word? What is spiritual authority and whom does it belong? Which of today's pastors own the authority that comes from God? Which are God ordained? How do you determine such? Is it by judging their teaching and fruit?
So you would say you have no spiritual authority from God unless under an apostle of God? I would hate to think your answer would be no, because that would mean that you would have to accept everything a man said that spoke from a pulpit that claimed he was ordained of God.

Because a man claims he is of God, does not make it so, right? I mean there are probably hundreds of thousands that make such claims and you would have to obey them.



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luchnia
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Re: Is disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

Post by luchnia » Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:25 pm

branham1965 wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 8:15 am
I do not believe one has to be under an Apostle .
What you posted there was really my point to your earlier posts.

Spiritual authority comes from above by the Spirit. We know there are many false teachers out there that are counterfeiting the real thing and then there are also many that are simply ignorant and care not to grow in knowledge of the Lord.

My point in the thread using Paul as an example was that it is not wrong to dispute and argue God's word as long as it is done in the right heart. The intent of such is greatly respected. It is not about strife and contention at all, but growing in knowledge of God. As His saints, we desire what God desires.

Even a wise man will welcome reproof and instruction, yet if a man is not wise, he doubtfully will not welcome it, nor will he be grounded enough to discern the source and intent behind it.


Word up!

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Re: Is disputing and argument wrong? Paul did not think so.

Post by Hill Top » Thu Jan 03, 2019 1:46 pm

luchnia wrote:
Thu Jan 03, 2019 12:25 pm
My point in the thread using Paul as an example was that it is not wrong to dispute and argue God's word as long as it is done in the right heart. The intent of such is greatly respected. It is not about strife and contention at all, but growing in knowledge of God. As His saints, we desire what God desires.

Even a wise man will welcome reproof and instruction, yet if a man is not wise, he doubtfully will not welcome it, nor will he be grounded enough to discern the source and intent behind it.
Acts 15 is a good example of this.



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