Dake Bible Discussion BoardPolitics And Christians

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Hill Top
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Hill Top » Fri Oct 12, 2018 11:38 pm

Ironman wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:00 pm
Hill-Top doesn't have a clue. Human government is God ordained
I hope then, that you can see that our voting for or against any candidate is a worthless endeavor.
I agree with you billy. All administrators of human government, when they rule contrary to the law of God will be punished in due time by God for mismanagement of their authority. God never sanctions selfish and wicked administration of authority, and if such continues long it will be overthrown. Men are under obligation to obey human government when, and as long as the requirements are not inconsistent with the moral law's of God.
Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreme; or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).
How does voting for the lesser of two evils set with "the moral laws of God"?
Many Christians argue that it is sinful to partake in politics, that it is contrary to the Bible because human government is maintained by force, and that force is contrary with the spirit of the gospel.
Maybe it is the punctuation or grammar you use, but it seems you contradict yourself here. ?
These are false theories. Human government was instituted by God as shown above, and Christians are commanded in the New Testament to pay taxes and otherwise support government (Read Rom. 13:1-7; 1 Pet. 2:13-17).
Human government was instituted by men who wanted to be like the surrounding wicked nations. (1 Sam 12:12)
Paying taxes and voting for wicked men are two different subjects.



macca
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by macca » Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:01 am

Christians MUST have an import in the running of their countries.
Especially in this time that we have not totalitarian rulers over us.
Because we can vote them in and vote them out and pray for them according to God's word to grant them wisdom
so that we, God's people can live a Godly life in all freedom in Christ.



Hill Top
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Hill Top » Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:21 am

macca wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:01 am
Christians MUST have an import in the running of their countries.
Especially in this time that we have not totalitarian rulers over us.
Because we can vote them in and vote them out and pray for them according to God's word to grant them wisdom
so that we, God's people can live a Godly life in all freedom in Christ.
I am glad you believe God's people CAN live Godly lives.
I also join you in gratitude to God that the totalitarians have not usurped power...yet.



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Ironman
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Ironman » Sat Oct 13, 2018 1:20 am

Hill Top wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 11:38 pm
Ironman wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:00 pm
Hill-Top doesn't have a clue. Human government is God ordained
I hope then, that you can see that our voting for or against any candidate is a worthless endeavor.
I agree with you billy. All administrators of human government, when they rule contrary to the law of God will be punished in due time by God for mismanagement of their authority. God never sanctions selfish and wicked administration of authority, and if such continues long it will be overthrown. Men are under obligation to obey human government when, and as long as the requirements are not inconsistent with the moral law's of God.
Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreme; or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).
How does voting for the lesser of two evils set with "the moral laws of God"?
Many Christians argue that it is sinful to partake in politics, that it is contrary to the Bible because human government is maintained by force, and that force is contrary with the spirit of the gospel.
Maybe it is the punctuation or grammar you use, but it seems you contradict yourself here. ?
These are false theories. Human government was instituted by God as shown above, and Christians are commanded in the New Testament to pay taxes and otherwise support government (Read Rom. 13:1-7; 1 Pet. 2:13-17).
Human government was instituted by men who wanted to be like the surrounding wicked nations. (1 Sam 12:12)
Paying taxes and voting for wicked men are two different subjects.
What I posted and mentioned in an earlier post was taken from Dakes plan for man. That and the Scriptures he provided in support is all I need. I believe what I read. God instituted human government with Noah and God said it was for perpetual generations. (Gen. 9:1-7).


Galatians 4: 16, Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

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Ironman
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Ironman » Sat Oct 13, 2018 1:25 am

macca wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 12:01 am
Christians MUST have an import in the running of their countries.
Especially in this time that we have not totalitarian rulers over us.
Because we can vote them in and vote them out and pray for them according to God's word to grant them wisdom
so that we, God's people can live a Godly life in all freedom in Christ.
:angel: :angel: :angel:

If we don't vote our adversary will take over completely as he has done in countries where voting is not on the agenda at all and protestors are killed.

All administrators of human government, when they rule contrary to the law of God will be punished in due time by God for mismanagement of their authority. God never sanctions selfish and wicked administration of authority, and if such continues long it will be overthrown. Men are under obligation to obey human government when, and as long as the requirements are not inconsistent with the moral law's of God.

Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreem; or unto govenors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).


Galatians 4: 16, Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

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luchnia
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by luchnia » Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:39 am

Ironman wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 1:25 am
Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreem; or unto govenors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).
So since this is from Peter, would you be inclined to imply that Peter went against his own words when he chose not to obey the men of his government? These things must be understood in the intended concept and they won't get sideways. Notice carefully the words "as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers" and ask yourself what do you do when a government fails to put lawlessness down?

Do you continue to obey every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake, even if that ordinance is against the Lord? Peter never taught that. Peter's doctrine was more along the lines of whether we obey man or God, but when we know obeying man is wrong, we choose God. Not that this is a problem for us now, but when that day comes one must know the difference.


Word up!

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Ironman
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Ironman » Sat Oct 13, 2018 4:14 pm

luchnia wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:39 am
Ironman wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 1:25 am
Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreem; or unto govenors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).
So since this is from Peter, would you be inclined to imply that Peter went against his own words when he chose not to obey the men of his government? These things must be understood in the intended concept and they won't get sideways. Notice carefully the words "as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers" and ask yourself what do you do when a government fails to put lawlessness down?

Do you continue to obey every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake, even if that ordinance is against the Lord? Peter never taught that. Peter's doctrine was more along the lines of whether we obey man or God, but when we know obeying man is wrong, we choose God. Not that this is a problem for us now, but when that day comes one must know the difference.

Its not complicated. If God says obey those over you, I will obey those over us, unless they command me to obey things that lead to sin. Why nit-pick every Scripture and command of God? I will obey God to the best of my ability, you do as you like.


Galatians 4: 16, Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

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branham1965
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by branham1965 » Sat Oct 13, 2018 4:54 pm

:angel: :angel: amen mate.
Ironman wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 4:14 pm
luchnia wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:39 am
Ironman wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 1:25 am
Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreem; or unto govenors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).
So since this is from Peter, would you be inclined to imply that Peter went against his own words when he chose not to obey the men of his government? These things must be understood in the intended concept and they won't get sideways. Notice carefully the words "as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers" and ask yourself what do you do when a government fails to put lawlessness down?

Do you continue to obey every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake, even if that ordinance is against the Lord? Peter never taught that. Peter's doctrine was more along the lines of whether we obey man or God, but when we know obeying man is wrong, we choose God. Not that this is a problem for us now, but when that day comes one must know the difference.

Its not complicated. If God says obey those over you, I will obey those over us, unless they command me to obey things that lead to sin. Why nit-pick every Scripture and command of God? I will obey God to the best of my ability, you do as you like.



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luchnia
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by luchnia » Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:12 pm

Ironman wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 4:14 pm
Why nit-pick every Scripture and command of God? I will obey God to the best of my ability, you do as you like.
This is a simple answer. Because Jesus taught us to. I will obey God to the best of my ability, you can do as you like.


Word up!

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Ironman
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Ironman » Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:31 pm

luchnia wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 6:12 pm
Ironman wrote:
Sat Oct 13, 2018 4:14 pm
Why nit-pick every Scripture and command of God? I will obey God to the best of my ability, you do as you like.
This is a simple answer. Because Jesus taught us to. I will obey God to the best of my ability, you can do as you like.
I'm sure God does not want any of His children to be nit-picking, fussy, pendantic, fault-finders over tiny or unimportant details.There's nothing wrong with focusing on the details, but someone who is pedantic makes a big display, as you and Hill-Top often do, of knowing obscure facts and details.


Galatians 4: 16, Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

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