Dake Bible Discussion BoardPolitics And Christians

General Discussion Forum devoted to the study of God's Word in Honor of Finis J. Dake.
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Hill Top
Behold, I Give You Power to Tread Over All the Power of the Enemy
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Hill Top » Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:31 pm

Grandfather wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:52 pm
It is also written --- Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. (Romans 14:4) ---- Why do you pass judgment on your brother? Or you, why do you despise your brother? Rom 14:10
If you feel "judged" that is on you.
Perhaps a guilty conscience is kicking in?
I don't despise even the most evil of men.
Those voting for the second most evil of candidates will be judged by God for that evil and all the other evils they have committed.
Just imagine that you didn't vote for evil men...we could be in agreement here !
And indeed if all things work, then both those that vote and those that abstain from voting are right in doing so. Much like those that of those that eat and those that abstain from eating... Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him. (Rom 14:3)
If voting for wicked men doesn't offend your conscience then ignore my exhortations.



Grandfather
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Grandfather » Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:33 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:23 pm
Grandfather wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:36 pm
I will assume you are from Arkansas since the website you posted was from there. If you will re-read the site, there were 162 ballot measures and 76, less than half, were from petitions of citizens. Now, follow the link to citizens and dig a little and you will discover that a majority of those were sponsored or encouraged by political office holders but not legislators. (technical difference, both were voted into an office)
Your assumption is wrong.
76 were petitions from citizens.
We needed no politicians for those issues.
Which assumption? That you were from Arkansas? That is the only assumption made. The article was about Arkansas and I stated that 76 of the 162 measures were from the citizens. That is not an assumption it is straight from the article. I also stated that if you followed all the links you would discover that the major of those 76 were tied to, started by those in political office that were not legislators. Again that is fact, not assumption and it came from your source.

Hill Top wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:23 pm
Grandfather wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:36 pm
And perhaps the reason my defense if palpable - capable of being true - is because there is truth there.
As I said earlier, you do not have to vote, that is between you and the Lord. But for those that do vote, again it is between them and the Lord. He judges them, not you.
I am glad I have your "permission" not to vote for the lesser of two evils.
I didn't give you "permission" so save the snide comments.



Grandfather
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Grandfather » Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:39 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:31 pm
Grandfather wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 7:52 pm
It is also written --- Who are you to pass judgment on the servant of another? It is before his own master that he stands or falls. (Romans 14:4) ---- Why do you pass judgment on your brother? Or you, why do you despise your brother? Rom 14:10
If you feel "judged" that is on you.
Perhaps a guilty conscience is kicking in?
I don't despise even the most evil of men.
Those voting for the second most evil of candidates will be judged by God for that evil and all the other evils they have committed.
Just imagine that you didn't vote for evil men...we could be in agreement here !
And indeed if all things work, then both those that vote and those that abstain from voting are right in doing so. Much like those that of those that eat and those that abstain from eating... Let not the one who eats despise the one who abstains, and let not the one who abstains pass judgment on the one who eats, for God has welcomed him. (Rom 14:3)
If voting for wicked men doesn't offend your conscience then ignore my exhortations.
I don't feel judged by you.... you give yourself WAY to much credit or importance... besides you would not violate the scripture that tells you not to judge a brother. (quoted above) Or the scriptures that say you are to approach them privately first, something you haven't done. And if privately doesn't work you are to take someone to witness the attempt at reconciliation, again something you haven't done. Ah, if only you would follow the scriptures... Now, that is what might be called being a bad example of a Christian.



Hill Top
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Hill Top » Fri Oct 12, 2018 12:18 am

Grandfather wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:33 pm
Which assumption? That you were from Arkansas?
That is the only thing you had "assumed".
That is the only assumption made. The article was about Arkansas and I stated that 76 of the 162 measures were from the citizens. That is not an assumption it is straight from the article. I also stated that if you followed all the links you would discover that the major of those 76 were tied to, started by those in political office that were not legislators. Again that is fact, not assumption and it came from your source.
That source included info for several sates, including mine now
I didn't give you "permission" so save the snide comments.
OK...you were doing it so often I figured it was the normal procedure here.
How 'bout we both quit trying to be cute?



Hill Top
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Hill Top » Fri Oct 12, 2018 12:29 am

Grandfather wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 11:39 pm
I don't feel judged by you.... you give yourself WAY to much credit or importance...
As i wrote..."If you feel judged...", so I guess you don't.
besides you would not violate the scripture that tells you not to judge a brother.
Or the scriptures that say you are to approach them privately first, something you haven't done. And if privately doesn't work you are to take someone to witness the attempt at reconciliation, again something you haven't done. Ah, if only you would follow the scriptures... Now, that is what might be called being a bad example of a Christian.
If I felt harmed by you I would have approached you privately.
But I never felt that way.
How come you didn't approach me privately?



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branham1965
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by branham1965 » Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:41 am

:angel: :angel: :angel:

bibleman wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 8:25 am
Hill Top wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:13 pm
bibleman wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 2:21 pm
If we all do what you do then we allow FULL - UNBRIDLED evil to rule and reign.
How can we do that?
Voting for the lesser of two evils won't change the dynamic of "this" world.
"We" are not of this world. (Eph 2:2)
Let the dead elect the dead.
Well if that be the case why not...

Let the devil spend your money for you.
Let the devil tell you who to marry.
Let the devil raise your children for you.
Let the devil tell you what kind of car to drive.
Let the devil tell you what kind of clothes to wear.

And on and on...

No we are responsible for this world we are in and should do our part to make it better as best we can.

To withdraw and turn it over to the Devil is not an option for the Christian who loves his fellow man.



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branham1965
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by branham1965 » Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:43 am

To say its a sin to vote or get behind the best candidates or issues for Federal,State and City government i disagree with that notion.


That is what the Jehovah's Witnesses teach.

Hill Top wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:20 pm
Grandfather wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:46 pm
Thank you for proving my point. Even you did not know this was possible until you web searched. However youo realized now how few and how far these are. Even with this few, there are politicians that benifit, support and encoourage them. You can’t get away from people.
"Your" point?
I think you got that backwards.
I live in a state where citizens initiatives are constantly in the paper.
These are brought forward without any politicians.
My vote to forestall recreational pot use doesn't need any politicians.
Your defense of the lesser of two evils is palpable...and scary.



Hill Top
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Hill Top » Fri Oct 12, 2018 1:44 pm

branham1965 wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:43 am
To say its a sin to vote or get behind the best candidates or issues for Federal,State and City government i disagree with that notion.
That is what the Jehovah's Witnesses teach.
If it feels OK to you to vote for the lesser of two evils...go on and vote for him/her.
I'll abstain.
As you don't believe anyone can be free from sin anyway, what harm can come from one more sin?



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Ironman
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Ironman » Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:00 pm

branham1965 wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:43 am
To say its a sin to vote or get behind the best candidates or issues for Federal,State and City government i disagree with that notion.


That is what the Jehovah's Witnesses teach.

Hill Top wrote:
Thu Oct 11, 2018 1:20 pm
Grandfather wrote:
Wed Oct 10, 2018 11:46 pm
Thank you for proving my point. Even you did not know this was possible until you web searched. However youo realized now how few and how far these are. Even with this few, there are politicians that benifit, support and encoourage them. You can’t get away from people.
"Your" point?
I think you got that backwards.
I live in a state where citizens initiatives are constantly in the paper.
These are brought forward without any politicians.
My vote to forestall recreational pot use doesn't need any politicians.
Your defense of the lesser of two evils is palpable...and scary.
Hill-Top doesn't have a clue. Human government is God ordained

I agree with you billy. All administrators of human government, when they rule contrary to the law of God will be punished in due time by God for mismanagement of their authority. God never sanctions selfish and wicked administration of authority, and if such continues long it will be overthrown. Men are under obligation to obey human government when, and as long as the requirements are not inconsistent with the moral law's of God.

Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreme; or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).

Many Christians argue that it is sinful to partake in politics, that it is contrary to the Bible because human government is maintained by force, and that force is contrary with the spirit of the gospel.

These are false theories. Human government was instituted by God as shown above, and Christians are commanded in the New Testament to pay taxes and otherwise support government (Read Rom. 13:1-7; 1 Pet. 2:13-17).


Galatians 4: 16, Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

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Ironman
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Re: Politics And Christians

Post by Ironman » Fri Oct 12, 2018 4:01 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 1:44 pm
branham1965 wrote:
Fri Oct 12, 2018 3:43 am
To say its a sin to vote or get behind the best candidates or issues for Federal,State and City government i disagree with that notion.
That is what the Jehovah's Witnesses teach.
If it feels OK to you to vote for the lesser of two evils...go on and vote for him/her.
I'll abstain.
As you don't believe anyone can be free from sin anyway, what harm can come from one more sin?
Hill-Top, Human government is God ordained. All administrators of human government, when they rule contrary to the law of God will be punished in due time by God for mismanagement of their authority. God never sanctions selfish and wicked administration of authority, and if such continues long it will be overthrown. Men are under obligation to obey human government when, and as long as the requirements are not inconsistent with the moral law's of God.

Christians must always obey "every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the King, as supreme; or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him for the punishment of evil doers, and for the praise of them that do well. For such is the will of God, that with well doing ye may put to silence the ignorance of foolish men" (1 Pet. 2:13-17).

Many Christians argue that it is sinful to partake in politics, that it is contrary to the Bible because human government is maintained by force, and that force is contrary with the spirit of the gospel.

These are false theories. Human government was instituted by God as shown above, and Christians are commanded in the New Testament to pay taxes and otherwise support government (Read Rom. 13:1-7; 1 Pet. 2:13-17).


Galatians 4: 16, Am I therefore become your enemy, because I tell you the truth?

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