Dake Bible Discussion BoardUnto what then were ye baptized

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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:31 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:59 pm
[Stoning Stephen was] A crime worthy of death?
Yes, the folks that stoned Stephen and consented to his death committed a crime worthy of death.


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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:31 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:59 pm
Yet those people [that stoned Stephen] were obedient to the Mosaic Law in their actions.
No, they were not.

Why do you think that stoning Stephen was required by the Mosaic Law?


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"Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." — 2 CORINTHIANS 5:17

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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:32 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:59 pm
Stephen even asked God not to hold their sin [of stoning him] against them, in Acts 7:60.
Yes, he did.

And, stoning him was sinful.


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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:32 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:59 pm
Would you illicit the death penalty to Stephen, a perceived heretic?
Or would you illicit the death penalty on those who murdered him?
No. Stoning Stephen was a sin. They would have been better off if they'd have waited for due process and, perhaps, cooler heads would have prevailed? How Gamailel addressed an earlier situation comes to mind (Acts 5:34-39).

This was a mob-mentality murder. Not a just execution after a fair trial under righteous law.


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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:32 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 9:59 pm
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 6:59 pm
Even Paul, in the New Testament, was not opposed to turning folks over to Satan.
You impute death, while Paul commanded forgiveness.
Paul understood right from wrong. And, he knew when to forgive and when not to.


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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:35 pm

Hill Top wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:06 pm
Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 7:00 pm
Isn't it a sin for us to disagree with His judgment in these matters? And, to fail to pray in line with His revealed will in such matters?
Killing men is a sin.
Not always. Sometimes, it is sinful not to.

One example is that the government is charged with carrying out the death penalty when righteousness requires that it do so.


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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Spiritblade Disciple » Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:43 pm

Ironman wrote:
Tue Nov 06, 2018 10:18 pm
Exo 20:13
Thou shalt not kill.
Deu 5:17
Thou shalt not kill.
Mat 5:21
Ye have heard that it was said by3 them of old time, Thou shalt not kill; and whosoever shall kill shall be in danger of the judgment:
Rom 13:9
For this, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not kill, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness, Thou shalt not covet; and if there be any other commandment, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

Gen 9:6
Whoso sheddeth man's blood, by man shall his blood be shed: for in the image of God made he man.
Hi, Haz,

I like Dakes note on Genesis 9:6:
The death penalty for murder is commanded here. God's pledge to Cain was a sevenfold penalty (Gen. 4:15), perhaps referring to greater damnation in hell (Mt. 23:14).

Five Reasons Why Murder Is a Great Crime

1. It's a crime against God who created man in His own image (Gen. 1:26-28; 9:6).

2. It manifests hatred of God's image.

3. It's a crime against society, of which each man is an important part.

4. It's a crime against the family unit.

5. It's a crime against the one whose life is taken. It cuts him off from his duties to both God and man, and seals his eternal doom if he isn't saved. Murder is a serious crime (Gen. 9:5-6; Ex. 21:29-32; Num. 35:16-31; Dt. 17:6; 21:1-9; 27:24-25; 1Ki. 21:19; 2Chr. 24:22; Mt. 5:21-22; 15:19; Gal. 5:19-21; 1Tim. 1:9; Jas. 2:11; 1Pet. 4:15; 1Jn. 3:15; Rev. 9:21; 21:8; 22:15). See Forty-two Death-Penalty Sins


Dake's Annotated Reference Bible: Containing the Old and New Testaments of the Authorized or King James Version Text.
I also like the Jesus clarifies that the command not to kill in the Ten Commandments is against murder, not such killing as is demanded by righteousness. ("Thou shalt do no murder" — Matt. 19:18.)


KNOW YOU'RE KNEW
"Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new." — 2 CORINTHIANS 5:17

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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Hill Top » Fri Nov 09, 2018 11:49 pm

luchnia wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 12:51 pm
If you think that is the case then then Jesus will fail miserably when He carries out justice and judgment according to the NT.
In what regard?



Hill Top
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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Hill Top » Fri Nov 09, 2018 11:55 pm

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:31 pm
Absolutely. I would definitely say that Stephen was murdered.
Would you definitely say that the Jews who stoned him should be killed?
They were murderers, right?
So they should get the death penalty...right?
But what did Stephen say?
He asked the Lord to have mercy on them.
Should we not be doing the same?
Or would you have said..."No Lord, Don't listen to Stephen,...Kill them all !"



Hill Top
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Re: Unto what then were ye baptized

Post by Hill Top » Sat Nov 10, 2018 12:16 am

Spiritblade Disciple wrote:
Fri Nov 09, 2018 10:31 pm
No, they were not.

Why do you think that stoning Stephen was required by the Mosaic Law?
To the Jews-Pharisees, Stephen was a heretic, A bearer of false doctrine. He allegedly had spoken blasphemous words against Moses and against God. (False accusations)
( I really couldn't find any mention of what to do to heretics in the OT, but the Pharisees were consenting unto Stephens death)
And I know they killed him because of jealousy, and not because of anything they could actually accuse him of.



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