Dake Bible Discussion BoardBelieve ONLY and be saved? Anderson? Swaggart?

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bibleman
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Re: Believe ONLY and be saved? Anderson? Swaggart?

Post by bibleman »

Here is what Dake said about the subject!
When God said to Adam, “Ye shall surely die,” he meant it; and when He says to saved men today that the soul that sinneth it shall die, He means it. This applies to all men who sin and saved men today are no exception. Both Adam and Eve believed the first teacher of unconditional eternal security, the devil, and lost eternal life. So it is today with all who sin and believe the modern lie of the devil that sinning-saints cannot be lost.
Finis J. Dake, God's Plan for Man, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2004), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 665.
Now apparently you guys think differently, and that is your right.

But because it is your right to believe error it does not mean it IS BIBLE!

You are teaching Christians that they can sin and still go to heaven, which is no salvation at all.

I am sticking with the Bible.

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.
21 But if the wicked will turn from all his sins that he hath committed, and keep all my statutes, and do that which is lawful and right, he shall surely live, he shall not die.
22 All his transgressions that he hath committed, they shall not be mentioned unto him: in his righteousness that he hath done he shall live.
23 Have I any pleasure at all that the wicked should die? saith the Lord GOD: and not that he should return from his ways, and live?
24 But when the righteous turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and doeth according to all the abominations that the wicked man doeth, shall he live? All his righteousness that he hath done shall not be mentioned: in his trespass that he hath trespassed, and in his sin that he hath sinned, in them shall he die.
25 Yet ye say, The way of the Lord is not equal. Hear now, O house of Israel; Is not my way equal? are not your ways unequal?
26 When a righteous man turneth away from his righteousness, and committeth iniquity, and dieth in them; for his iniquity that he hath done shall he die.
27 Again, when the wicked man turneth away from his wickedness that he hath committed, and doeth that which is lawful and right, he shall save his soul alive. (KJV)


God bless
Leon Bible

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The fault in Bible complications is not with God or the Bible, but with men who refuse to believe what God says and think we have to interpret what He says in order to get the meaning. Dake Bible -Mark 11:17 note

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branham1965
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Re: Believe ONLY and be saved? Anderson? Swaggart?

Post by branham1965 »

Pastor,

could you briefly explain the second one please??



titus213 wrote:there have always been two perversions of grace we are always needing to be on guard against: the hyper grace attitude, and Galatianism which mixes the keeping of some kind of law with grace.



titus213
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Re: Believe ONLY and be saved? Anderson? Swaggart?

Post by titus213 »

Hi Billy,

Brief explanation: Galatianism (or as some call it, Judaizing) comes from the false teaching Paul fought against in the Book of Galatians. It’s the claim that a person can ultimately be saved by Jesus Christ ONLY if he keeps the commandments of God.
- - - - -- - - - -- - - - -- - - - -
Long explanation: Often it’s taught like this: I am saved at first by the grace of Jesus Christ, then I am kept saved by obedience to the commandments of some law. In the final analysis this means I will only be saved if I am good enough. This was behind the hypocrisy of Peter that Paul got so upset about in Galatians 2. As Paul says, Peter was in effect nullifying the grace of God, because “if righteousness comes through law, then Christ died needlessly.”

What this false teaching misses is this fact: According to the Bible, even one sin creates a debt of punishment that we ourselves can never pay with our obedience, because “whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all” (James 2:10).

This is why we must rely on the grace of Jesus Christ alone, unmixed with our works, as our only way into heaven. Even the most obedient believer fails to keep all the commands as soon as he stumbles over one! We all deserve punishment. But Jesus took that penalty upon Himself. THAT is the basis of our salvation.

Does this mean that a Christian can murder someone and still go to heaven (as Leon keeps saying I believe)? Of course not. The faith that saves is a faith that obeys. The believer is a new creation in Christ, with a new heart and a new nature. He WANTS to obey Christ’s commands, and is now ABLE to. The Holy Spirit is now living in him and giving direction to his life. This is Paul’s emphasis in Romans 6-8.

But can the Christian still choose to walk according to the flesh rather than according to the Spirit (Romans 8:4)? Yes, according to Romans 8:12-13. And if a believer DOES continue to make that choice, what will happen? Paul tells us: “if you are living according to the flesh, you must die” (8:13). To “die” cannot mean die physically, because that will happen to us anyway. Paul means to die spiritually by reverting to an unsaved condition . . . to die eternally in hell. This is why I said previously that our faith in Christ (which leads us to obey and enables us to obey) can be strangled by our decision to “continue in sin so that grace may increase” (Romans 6:1).

branham1965 wrote:Pastor,

could you briefly explain the second one please??



titus213 wrote:there have always been two perversions of grace we are always needing to be on guard against: the hyper grace attitude, and Galatianism which mixes the keeping of some kind of law with grace.



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bibleman
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Re: Believe ONLY and be saved? Anderson? Swaggart?

Post by bibleman »

titus213 wrote:Hi Billy,

Brief explanation: Galatianism (or as some call it, Judaizing) comes from the false teaching Paul fought against in the Book of Galatians. It’s the claim that a person can ultimately be saved by Jesus Christ ONLY if he keeps the commandments of God.
- - - - -
Long explanation: Often it’s taught like this: I am saved at first by the grace of Jesus Christ, then I am kept saved by obedience to the commandments of some law. In the final analysis this means I will only be saved if I am good enough. This was behind the hypocrisy of Peter that Paul got so upset about in Galatians 2. As Paul says, Peter was in effect nullifying the grace of God, because “if righteousness comes through law, then Christ died needlessly.”

What this false teaching misses is this fact: According to the Bible, even one sin creates a debt of punishment that we ourselves can never pay with our obedience, because “whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles in one point, he has become guilty of all” (James 2:10).

This is why we must rely on the grace of Jesus Christ alone, unmixed with our works, as our only way into heaven. Even the most obedient believer fails to keep all the commands as soon as he stumbles over one! We all deserve punishment. But Jesus took that penalty upon Himself. THAT is the basis of our salvation.

Does this mean that a Christian can murder someone and still go to heaven (as Leon keeps saying I believe)? Of course not. The faith that saves is a faith that obeys. The believer is a new creation in Christ, with a new heart and a new nature. He WANTS to obey Christ’s commands, and is now ABLE to. The Holy Spirit is now living in him and giving direction to his life. This is Paul’s emphasis in Romans 6-8.

But can the Christian still choose to walk according to the flesh rather than according to the Spirit (Romans 8:4)? Yes, according to Romans 8:12-13. And if a believer DOES continue to make that choice, what will happen? Paul tells us: “if you are living according to the flesh, you must die” (8:13). To “die” cannot mean die physically, because that will happen to us anyway. Paul means to die spiritually by reverting to an unsaved condition . . . to die eternally in hell. This is why I said previously that our faith in Christ (which leads us to obey and enables us to obey) can be strangled by our decision to “continue in sin so that grace may increase” (Romans 6:1).
branham1965 wrote:Pastor,

could you briefly explain the second one please??
titus213 wrote:there have always been two perversions of grace we are always needing to be on guard against: the hyper grace attitude, and Galatianism which mixes the keeping of some kind of law with grace.
Thank you for your further explanation, it is most helpful in understanding your point of view.

1) BUT above you say: This is why we must rely on the grace of Jesus Christ alone, unmixed with our works, as our only way into heaven.

2) THEN you say: Does this mean that a Christian can murder someone and still go to heaven (as Leon keeps saying I believe)? Of course not.

In point 1 you say: "unmixed with our works"

In point 2 you say: the work of "murder" can keep someone out of Heaven.

This is talking out of both sides of our mouths to believe such.

The truth is man is saved by grace AND works. (If not all would be saved)
And he stays saved by grace AND works! (If not no one would ever lose their salvation)

YOU prove that statement by saying that a Christian who commits murder does NOT go to Heaven. What kept him out of Heaven? The fact that his WORK of murder or the LACK of a work of righteousness (not murder) was committed. So here you are admitting that it is NOT grace alone that keeps one saved.
Naturally, men are saved by grace, but not without the free and voluntary choice of acceptance of the work of Christ and proper confession of sins to God and faith in the blood of Christ. All the grace of God in existence could not save one soul if that soul refused the merits of that grace. Thus, in the final analysis, man governs his personal salvation by his power of free choice. Salvation is naturally the work of God for man, but God cannot save man without his free consent and co-operation with God from the new birth to the grave. So the idea that man's salvation depends only on the grace of God and on grace alone, and that it is the work of God only and the work of God alone, is false. Finis J. Dake, God's Plan for Man, (Lawrenceville, GA: Dake Publishing, Inc., 2004), WORDsearch CROSS e-book, 339.


God bless
Leon Bible

http://www.ministryhelps.com
http://www.dakebible.com
http://www.dakebibleboard.com
https://www.facebook.com/groups/DakeBibleDiscussion/

The fault in Bible complications is not with God or the Bible, but with men who refuse to believe what God says and think we have to interpret what He says in order to get the meaning. Dake Bible -Mark 11:17 note

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