Hello Justaned, and Rocky!Justaned wrote:Rocky
Please don't think I was miminizing or dismissing your story or your experience. I do appreciate you sharing it and seriously I'm trying to reconcile what you are saying to what I believe scripture is saying.
I can accept I'm not interpreting scripture correctly but I need someone to do more that say your wrong or my experience proves you wrong. I need to see where in both these passages I failed to grasp the correct meaning of what is being said.
As I said in the other thread. I fail to understand how a God created NEW BEING would intentional set about to sin.
Let me ask you this could you right now go out and really sin? I don't mean to slip and mess up but rather say to yourself (assumeing you are married) okay today I going out to find someone to commit adultery with and then actually do it.
I know I can't.
So I wonder how does a person get from saved to that point. If you can shed any light on it I would love to hear it.
Again I'm not saying you can't sin or that you are sinless. We all stumble and fall. I saying you intentionally set out to sin.
God Bless You Both, and All That Is Yours...
Okay, I'm not Rocky, but I couldn't let this quote, and my answer to it, go away... Thank-you, Both.
We appear to agree, but for semantics... I don't think any of the three of us could go out, decide that we're going to commit sin, of any size or degree- for sin is sin, and is contrary to God's Will... I believe that we three are "sold-out to God." I don't question that, nor do I disagree with either of your positions.
Justaned, you said, "I think what is key here is allegiance and felt." I would amend that to read, "consecrated," rather than "allegiance." Why? Because consecration is something that one does to God, and to no other entity, whereas allegiance does not connote the strength and depth to which one is dedicated. Allegiance can be "lip service," whereas consecration is as God said for us to be, and do- "Be ye Holy, as I AM Holy."
It is entirely possible, using your position, Justaned, to see where one might not be "saved," or know God's Love, Mercy, Grace, and Kindness, in the Salvation process, if one does not act, or live, as one "saved." You make a good case in that, which, however, does not preclude Rocky from being a Child of God, as well as a Citizen of Heaven.
At some point in time, we all come to a point where we face God, stop taking Him for granted, concede all that we've ever been, are now, or ever will be, to Him, where He comes first, always, and we are, by choice, never again the same... Given enough time, we all grow-up. Only God knows that point of demarcation, where we get "serious" with God, and truly become the sheep of His Pasture.
I cannot, in clear conscience, nor in my innermost being, doubt Rocky, and the transformation he underwent, to become restored to God. In studying The Word, and by The Holy Spirit, I believe Rocky does not "just" believe what he is saying, but that God's Precious Holy Spirit is present in his life, and He bears witness of that change to one consecrated unto God, The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit.
In the last 96 hours, I've fought the demons representing the Mormon Cult, in a neighbor and friend, a much respected local man, for his very soul... In being obedient to what God would have me say, I thereby came under attack. I'm calling the "experience," The Long Dark Night of the Soul... Satan marshaled his forces, and until the wee hours of this day, I was as unsure of myself, as ever I did not think it was possible to be... But God is Faithful, for He said, "I will never leave you, nor forsake you..." He hasn't, and He never will...
I have never known such loneliness, such desolation. I was crying out to God, "Lord, please speak to me, and let me know that you are there..." It was as if I were confined in a bell jar, and nothing got in, or out. I seemed cut-off from the outside world, and that God was not answering my cries, or my prayers. I continued to practice His Presence, to talk to Him, as an individual, best friend, confidant, mentor, and Faithful Companion... At times, I was inclined to study certain passages of The Scriptures. At other times, though I could not hear Him, as in times past, I knew He was somewhere near, though the "feeling" of being cut-off, was oppressively there, immovable...
I studied His Word, and did everything I could to get rid of any hindrance to getting near Him. I went back over my life, looking for sins I may have knowingly, or unknowingly, committed. Sins of commission and sins of omission, I considered. Had I already confessed something, as well as repenting of that sin, but still have sinned, and would not therefore receive forgiveness from Him? I was in agony, oppressed from all sides, relentlessly, Satan attacked.
You know the drill- "You're not worthy!" "You're destined for the Lake of Fire, because you're a sinner!" "God doesn't love you- He never did!" At such times, "it's tough to remember you're there to drain the swamp, when you're up to your fanny in alligators..." Imagine being an airplane pilot, and not being able to see the horizon- disaster has claimed many such... I was in that position. Saved, but not knowing where I was, where I was going, and not knowing when I'd get there... It was a Hell of indecision and emptiness... I can see how those less prepared, could actually take their own lives... Praise God! For His Word, and His Faithfulness... Truly, His Grace is sufficient for me...
In relying upon The Scriptures, and upon the leading of The Holy Spirit of God, I was able to see things from His perspective, and weather the storm... I can just say that God's Love, Mercy, Grace, and His Everlasting Kindnesses, as shown through His Word, and illuminated by His Spirit, once again gave me hope, based upon The Word of God- nothing of Man...
I never lost faith in God, nor my belief in Him. He is ever faithful. All the Blessings of God are mine, not because of me, but due to His Love, Mercy, Grace, and infinite Kindness. I know that some here believe that there are no "second chances" beyond a certain, possibly arbitrary, point, but that's what I've seen, in myself, and others. God has, and does, make a way...
I believe that God looks upon the heart of every person. He is faithful, as He will not go against His Word, nor will He not go to extraordinary lengths, to save those that were lost, for remember the one that was lost, where He left the ninety and nine, to go after the one, most needy...
I make no pretenses- coming out of The Long Dark Night of The Soul, and into the Light and Life of Christ Jesus, is a magnificent, new beginning, for it reaffirms that which I knew subjectively. It was, truly, a spiritual rebirth. Nay, it was once, and for all, a commitment, a mature consecration unto God The Father, The Son, and The Holy Spirit, that I reaffirmed... It was the definitive point where there were no more games, lip service, or half measures. I am His, and He is mine.
Consecration unto God. When He says, "Be Ye Holy, as I AM Holy," it is the real deal. I've heard what The Spirit has said, when outside, in the wind that whirls and rustles about; seen in the shooting stars across the night heavens testify of His Magnificence; and watched Life be reaffirmed in the blossoming of the desert, after a rainstorm... God IS God. Holy, Pure, True- His attributes are unending, and we'll have the honor of praising and worshiping Him Forever and Ever, Amen...
I hope I've made sense to you, for I have God's Peace, and He has given me a serenity, an acceptance, that whatever He wants, that's what I want too... He's called all of us to Holiness, just as He's called, and equipped us to do what He wants. The Gifts of God, are without repentance. So too, are those talents, skills, and strengths that He has endowed us with... Justaned, you may well be the best teacher I've yet encountered. Your gentleness reminds me of Lester Sumrall, as well as his thoroughness, objectivity, and his honesty. Most refreshing...
Rocky, you are compassion personified. Like the T-shirt says, you've "been there, done that, had the T-shirt, and have the scars to prove it." God's light shines through you, enabling you to reach the lost- the needy, the hurt, and the ones cast-off, or ignored by others, because of the "knowledge" of others... You have experienced life, and God has heard your cries, and has honored your hunger to share Jesus with a dead and dying world...
I will do what God tells me to do. I'm not a silver tongued, snake oil salesman. I'm as subtle as the blunt end of an axe. I've never been popular, nor will I ever be, this side of Heaven. I'll go right on passing on what He tells me, and let the chips fall where they may... Like I've said, I'm a simple man... Where God points me, I will go, attacking, defending, and doing whatever I can, to make Satan, and the perfumed ponces that infest pulpits and platforms, miserable. If they are God's People, I'll defend. If they're there to rule in their own names, God's got a pitbull, with my name on it's collar... In other words, He's letting me be myself, under His direction... Glorious...
Gentlemen, I'll side you, anywhere, anytime, for if God Be For Us, Who Can Be Against Us?
Maranatha
Watchman2013