Dake Bible Discussion Board ⇒ John 14:12...What was the "works" of Jesus?

[Justaned]

Ed: "Let us play a little game. It is an easy game not hard at all. When I mention healing who do you think of?"

Honestly? I thought of Jesus...until you told me who I should be thinking about.

Really? If so do you think that is what the majority thought?

I noticed when you talked about healing you referred to Copeland, saying Copeland this and Copeland that. So yes I do find that a little surprising but Praise God nonetheless if that was your first thought.

Here is the problem in this country the US healing has become synonymous with various ministries, ministries are known for being healing ministries, people seek them out as healers. They aren't seeking God they are seeking this man or woman that will heal them. That is where the problems lie. If these ministries are in fact healing people then something is wrong because they are definitely getting glory for it and not God and God said He would not share His glory.

[branham1965]

REVED
i am many things.but i try very hard to be straight.not a 2 face.
im disagreeing with you.it does not mean i dont care for you.i just disagree with you.
WHEN TL OSBORN AND DAISY MINISTERED TO THE MASSES IT WAS NOT WRONG TO ADVERTISE THE MEETINGS!!!THAT PRECIOUS WONDERFUL GODLY MAN NEVER HAD ONE THING BROUGHT AGAINST HIM.EVER.HE HAD PURITY IN HIM.AND LOVE AND MERCY FOR OTHERS.
A BOY HAD HIS EYES CREATED IN A MEETING.
MORRIS CERULLO ALSO HAD HUGE MEETINGS OVERSEAS AND IN SOUTH AMERICA.
many others have had sucess that way.
Sister Marilyn Hickey has ministered where no men could go.praying for the sick in a MOSQUE!!!!!!!!!
JESUS CHRIST THE SAME YESTERDAY TODAY AND FOREVER.

Ed: "Let us play a little game. It is an easy game not hard at all. When I mention healing who do you think of?"

Honestly? I thought of Jesus...until you told me who I should be thinking about.

Really? If so do you think that is what the majority thought?

I noticed when you talked about healing you referred to Copeland, saying Copeland this and Copeland that. So yes I do find that a little surprising but Praise God nonetheless if that was your first thought.

Here is the problem in this country the US healing has become synonymous with various ministries, ministries are known for being healing ministries, people seek them out as healers. They aren't seeking God they are seeking this man or woman that will heal them. That is where the problems lie. If these ministries are in fact healing people then something is wrong because they are definitely getting glory for it and not God and God said He would not share His glory.

[macca]

Sigh wonderful post Chris, as expected the response is normal.

the usual faith fighters try to controll such freedom of speach among believers.

macca

[Justaned]

REVED
i am many things.but i try very hard to be straight.not a 2 face.
im disagreeing with you.it does not mean i dont care for you.i just disagree with you.
WHEN TL OSBORN AND DAISY MINISTERED TO THE MASSES IT WAS NOT WRONG TO ADVERTISE THE MEETINGS!!!THAT PRECIOUS WONDERFUL GODLY MAN NEVER HAD ONE THING BROUGHT AGAINST HIM.EVER.HE HAD PURITY IN HIM.AND LOVE AND MERCY FOR OTHERS.
A BOY HAD HIS EYES CREATED IN A MEETING.
MORRIS CERULLO ALSO HAD HUGE MEETINGS OVERSEAS AND IN SOUTH AMERICA.
many others have had sucess that way.
Sister Marilyn Hickey has ministered where no men could go.praying for the sick in a MOSQUE!!!!!!!!!
JESUS CHRIST THE SAME YESTERDAY TODAY AND FOREVER.

Ed: "Let us play a little game. It is an easy game not hard at all. When I mention healing who do you think of?"

Honestly? I thought of Jesus...until you told me who I should be thinking about.

Really? If so do you think that is what the majority thought?

I noticed when you talked about healing you referred to Copeland, saying Copeland this and Copeland that. So yes I do find that a little surprising but Praise God nonetheless if that was your first thought.

Here is the problem in this country the US healing has become synonymous with various ministries, ministries are known for being healing ministries, people seek them out as healers. They aren't seeking God they are seeking this man or woman that will heal them. That is where the problems lie. If these ministries are in fact healing people then something is wrong because they are definitely getting glory for it and not God and God said He would not share His glory.

Billy
It is okay to disagree everyone has an opinion and no where does it say everyone's opinion must always agree.

Ponder this. Isaiah 42:8 (NKJV)
8 I am the LORD, that is My name; And My glory I will not give to another, Nor My praise to carved images.

Isaiah 48:11 (NKJV)
11 For My own sake, for My own sake, I will do it; For how should My name be profaned? And I will not give My glory to another.

When people connect a person or a ministry to healing instead of to the Lord there is a problem.

The problem could be the people that are making the connection or the problem could be the person that is in ministry that is allowing the connection to be made but in any case there is a problem. I think it is a very serious problem in the church today. People are taking their eyes off God and and instead are looking to a man.

My opinion.

[Justaned]

Sigh wonderful post Chris, as expected the response is normal.

the usual faith fighters try to controll such freedom of speach among believers.

macca

Macca
Is it faith fighters or is making sure people have their faith in God and not in some man that claims to have a healing ministry?
There is nothing wrong with faith, in fact God calls us to faith but that faith must always be centered squarely on God and not on anything else. We are also told to seek God not to seek after what God can do for us.

Do you want your children to love you for you or do you want them to love you for what you can give them? Do you think it is any different with God?

[cpbeller]

Ed: "I noticed when you talked about healing you referred to Copeland, saying Copeland this and Copeland that. So yes I do find that a little surprising but Praise God nonetheless if that was your first thought."

So, you made an assumption (a wrong assumption) about me because I used 2 quotes from Kenneth Copeland in a post, 2 qoutes that fit in my topic? I wonder how many other Christians and ministers you have assumed something about, is actually wrong.

And to be more specific...I actually thought about Acts 3, and what Peter said about the cripple being healed, and how:

Acts 3:12-16

"And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk? The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go. But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you; And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses. And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all."

The Name of Jesus, and faith in that Name...

[Justaned]

Ed: "I noticed when you talked about healing you referred to Copeland, saying Copeland this and Copeland that. So yes I do find that a little surprising but Praise God nonetheless if that was your first thought."

So, you made an assumption (a wrong assumption) about me because I used 2 quotes from Kenneth Copeland in a post, 2 qoutes that fit in my topic? I wonder how many other Christians and ministers you have assumed something about, is actually wrong.

And to be more specific...I actually thought about Acts 3, and what Peter said about the cripple being healed, and how:

Acts 3:12-16

"And when Peter saw it, he answered unto the people, Ye men of Israel, why marvel ye at this? or why look ye so earnestly on us, as though by our own power or holiness we had made this man to walk? The God of Abraham, and of Isaac, and of Jacob, the God of our fathers, hath glorified his Son Jesus; whom ye delivered up, and denied him in the presence of Pilate, when he was determined to let him go. But ye denied the Holy One and the Just, and desired a murderer to be granted unto you; And killed the Prince of life, whom God hath raised from the dead; whereof we are witnesses. And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all."

The Name of Jesus, and faith in that Name...

The discussion I titled What was the Works of Jesus?
I think to answer the we must first realize what was the purpose of Jesus' ministry on this earth.

I see this as discussion of that question, what was the purpose of Jesus' ministry on earth? I think that discussion must include what were the purposes of the signs and wonders Jesus did? Where they his works as some see them or where they a way to validate and get people's attention to his work of Salvation?

Further I see opportunity to discuss whether there is a problem with what people are actually seeking in the church today. Are they seeking God or manifestations?

However Chris you seem more interested in finding fault with me than wanting to discuss an issue. Therefore I see no point in going tit for tat with you as God knows I am a man of many fault.

[cpbeller]

I thought I spoke about what christians are seeing and doing...where the majority are chasing the signs...but the point still remains, the works Jesus spoke of was not His work on the cross...it was the miracles.

And those other passages you gave are at the very least out of context. Especially Matthew 24:24...you read that in context, Jesus is speaking about a VERY specific point in time. And most likely, the Church will not even be here when Matthew 24:24 takes place.

EDIT to add:

Why do you want to blame WoF ministers for the reason that many christians do not read their Bibles. If it is Kenneth Copeland's fault that christians do not read their Bibles, then it is your fault, too, as a pastor.

[Justaned]

Ed: "Let us play a little game. It is an easy game not hard at all. When I mention healing who do you think of?"

Honestly? I thought of Jesus...until you told me who I should be thinking about.

While I quote Cpbeller my attention is to address every reader of this thread.
I asked a question and upon reflection I now realize I asked a leading question, but supplying the answers I suspected would most be used. That damage is done and there is no way to salvage the question now. I apologize

However I think there is still a degree of validity in the question which is to force us to think about how we view "healings" and "healing ministries" our first thought should not be about the man doing the healing but rather on God. We don't need to travel across this country to be healed by a particular person if our faith is really in God.

[cpbeller]

Another question for those that believe that Jesus was not referring to the miracles that he did, and that he instead was referring to the work of the cross (salvation)...because it was only through the death and resurrection that man's relationship with God was restored...

How many ppl have you saved? How many ppl can credit their eternal salvation to you. How many souls have you plucked from the miry clay, and placed them on yourself? Jesus did say that those that believe will do greater works than He did. So, how many have you saved?